The 'New on Pump' thread!

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I will have to withdraw my 'naked' comment as he ended up sleeping in pyjama shorts! :D

But he still chose to have the pump loose in bed next to him. He seems very relaxed about this.

He said that he woke up this morning and that the pump was on the floor! I said 'eek' but he said it was no problem, it had not hurt him and he had just picked it up and put it back in bed.

Note to self "try not to 'eek' so easily". :D
 
I will have to withdraw my 'naked' comment as he ended up sleeping in pyjama shorts! :D

But he still chose to have the pump loose in bed next to him. He seems very relaxed about this.

He said that he woke up this morning and that the pump was on the floor! I said 'eek' but he said it was no problem, it had not hurt him and he had just picked it up and put it back in bed.

Note to self "try not to 'eek' so easily". :D

Jessica has always had her pump loose in bed. Believe me when I say she could get a gold in the wriggling olympics and still the pump is ok just loose.
 
Hello all

Sorry for lapse...busy day yesterday and another one today:

So long and short of it:

Generally, good. Woke yesterday on great number -- 5.5 or something, having settled down at 5.4 plus some juice -- yay! Great numbers all yesterday until the afternoon, when pear shaped came in: set out for bassoon exam without meter! Worse, had had pasta for lunch and didn't dual wave! Oops. Everyone slightly panicky, but must remain calm for exam...Had some free carb to cover the inevitable drop from a normal bolus for pasta...

And no surprise ended up a bit high later, 11mmol, pasta kicking in late. Had a snack and corrected. Still 11mmol at dinner though, a treat of chicken pita and chips out...Corrected for this of course with wizard, estimated like mad and...2.6 at 10pm. Oh my. Had actually *underestimated* the pita (looked it up when we got home!), so we weren't sure at time why crashed....

Juice and an hour later he was 7.1mmols. Ah...anticipated good number upon waking.

Woke on 16mmol! Eek! Of course, we all went, slapping our heads -- CHIPS!

I'm not sure he's had actual fried chips since diagnosis -- but clearly, they are mega-delayed. Which explains the hypo and the high this morning. Interesting to note though that we have none of this problem with oven chips, which he has all the time at home....

Sigh. Now we know. Ish. Now we have sent him off to school with a massive correction on board. Erk. Hope for best.

Live and learn. And things were going so *well*! (In truth, through the mistakes and mis-judgements, things were going well...so I must take heart!)

Must go. Deadlines. Horrible. Will check everyone else's threads in desperate breaks today! Hope all doing okay...
 
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Yes, do take heart, Patricia. I think maybe you need things to go a bit wobbly at times so you can learn further - eg eating fried chips for the first time etc. The more you can learn about different food and different situations the more you will be able to cope with things in the future.

An interesting post to read. Thanks. Hang on in there! You are still doing a terrific job despite the blips (blips are all part of the fun! Did i just say 'fun'????). :D

Look forward to more of your posts. 🙂🙂
 
Patricia, yes you are all doing great, we are all learning every day and think we always will,

example I was 17.7 going to bed last night, what?? was ok at tea and only had toast, checked again as really could not understand, yes 17.7, had supper and correction and 6.3 this morning.

Thing is on reading your thread i remembered I had fries at a buffet lunch yesterday, although fine at tea they must have really kicked in much later but I didnt think of that as not had that problem before, so thanks I learnt something else, 18months in! :D😱
 
Hi Patricia

Chips from a chip shop are horrendous. I still can't get them right. If we ever do, (very rarely) have fish & chips, J has battered sausage and small chips. She always goes high, we have tried square waves, dual waves all sort of combinations, normal bolus', normal with temp basal after and nothing works.
 
Thanks for all this, guys! Good to know we are not alone....

The chips were certainly fried -- real chips, in other words! But we don't have them at home, and he rarely orders them when out -- prefers new potatoes or whatever. Not fish and chip ones, but fried (Nando's!).

Sigh. Temp basal?
 
Oh I wish I didnt love chips so much! Absolutely without fail will muck me over unashammedly every single time. I havent dared tempt them on pump as yet, but I shall be utilising everything that pump has got (!).....and I anticipate that still wont be enough....

I guess temp basal might be the only option? Although, from her post we see Adrienne still cant get it right...then I think the word we might require is "surrender"!
Good luck! What a pain :( x
 
Again, a problem shared...thanks for good wishes!

I'm still mid-deadlines here (yes, okay, missing them!), so this again will be a short version, but just to say we continue to learn (and at times become befuddled).

Yesterday: high-ish all morning (11,12), corrected each time but did not bring him into range (insulin resistance?) -- but then *suddenly* he's, wait for it, 24mmols 🙂eek:😱) at 4.30pm!!! Yes he bolused lunch, yes he double checked my at times faulty lunch carb counting for him...SO he was home on own and did what wizard said: 5 units or something.

I tried not to look like I was rushing, but got home as quickly as I could. We had *never* given him such a large correction, and may not have even done so in this situation, but he followed instructions of wizard, and gulp...

So an hour later he was 14 (good grief! at least a set change was not in order). Half an hour later, 9mmols. Had dinner and fortunately wizard would not correct.

We held our breaths through an award ceremony at school (achievement and RE!), as this sort of situation is a classic hypo one for him: correction followed by a meal...however, he remained stable and arrived home at 8mmols. By bed he was 7mmols.

He had had a small, rushed dinner at 6pm. This is again a situation which we have found difficult to manage for him traditionally: not a lot of food will bring him low by morning -- before pump.

We tested him at 2.30am: he was 4.7mmol. After much deliberation, we decided to leave him and learn from the morning level. 3am *should* be the lowest of the night. By 6.30am he was fumbling with his kit, testing a 3.8 hypo.

SO: we conclude that we should have reminded him to eat. He was probably starving at the end of the night, and too excited to eat. Everyone else had a snack before bed. He hasn't dropped overnight in any significant way now in at least two weeks...so this is what we think....

Questions:

-- what do we do when corrections don't seem to bring him down? Temp basal? At what point?

-- *should* he still need to eat on a pump? He's not strictly speaking 'feeding' the basal insulin, because there isn't strictly speaking too much of it; in normal circumstances, it keeps him steady at night. But should the basal keep him steady *even if* he hasn't really had a lot of food? People without diabetes would feel wobbly and hungry by morning, but their bodies would cope. Is this something that people with diabetes just always have to plan for (along with everything else?!)

-- where the heck did that 24mmols come from? We have *racked* our brains, and nothing is out of the ordinary. A growing blip? He hasn't had a reading that high in weeks and weeks. And yes, his hands were clean!

Lordy. Will things *ever* settle? Do we have another 4 years of dealing with all over the place levels? (Maybe it's not that bad, don't know. But each day at the moment seems different, with the same levels of activity and food...ARGH!)
 
Hi Patricia,

I wonder if the 24mmols was pure excitement? I know that on occassion A has been excited and his levels can go quite high for no apparent reason. Its hard to bolus for excitement!

I suspect that he did have some resistance as the higher they are - the more insulin it requires to drop!

The only other explanation is that perhaps he is coming down with something?

Or could it be the insulin is out of date or has been affected by the hot weather?:confused:All very confusing isnt it? Let us know how things go today - hopefully this isnt a pattern.

I know you have said on a few occasions that being on the pump does mean that levels through the night remain stable - so if E was still on MDI - would you have given a snack when he was 4.7 at 2.30am? It seems amazing to me that things can stay much the same over a few hours! If A was 4.7 at this time of night i would give him milk and biscuits - because on MDI there doesnt seem to be that stability.🙂Bev
 
Hi Bev

Yes I wondered about excitement....He tried to think whether he was stressed or het up coming home...but it could just have been the awards. The weird thing is that it must have been a valid reading, because the huge correction actually brought him down over time. It wasn't just a quick blip...

Re the night: on MDI we probably would have been even more inclined to leave him on 4.7 at 3am, because all the documentation says that you are at your lowest then (Hanas suggests a 3am level of 5 ish, for instance, and that tells you that your basal on MDI is sound). So our expectation would be that he would rise before morning, which on MDI he would have done. We *might* have woken him up and given him a biscuit (8g) or something, but no more.

Last night we really did deliberate -- to leave or not to leave? I had a feeling that he'd dropped from lack of food (the drop is unusual now on the pump), but we really needed to see what a night left to its own devices did -- AND he'd been running high for HOURS in the day, and some of the day before. So we were fearful of over-dosing carb for such a short time til morning.

Normally, I'd expect E to stay even from 11pm to 7am without a problem, and very little variation (even at 3am), whatever level he's on. If things are good, apparently you can go to bed on 5s and 6s with no trouble. I think last night was just a little strange because he was probably hungry -- so he went from 7 to 3.8 overnight.

Sigh. Text received asking about carb for cake! Ack. Celebration in maths or something...
 
Oh Patricia! How unsettling for you all! I just do not have enough experience yet on the pump to be able to offer you advice. Why the 24?? What a mystery (unless he developing a cold or something). :(

Please let us know how things go. Have readings settled down again? I will be watching your post for an update.

Thinking of you and hoping you get things back on track! 🙂
 
Hi Patricia

I haven't commented on this thread, but I have been reading avidly! I have an appointment with my doctor next month, where we should discuss pumps, so it's been really interesting to read what it's actually like starting out! So thank you (and to all the other pumpers recently who are doing this) 🙂

I'm not sure what could have caused the 24 (like Bev says, maybe excitement?), but could the 24 have possibly caused his hypo during the night? I'm just wondering if his liver dumped a whole load of glucose when he had the 24, so didn't have quite enough to dribble out as much as it usually would overnight - kind of like if you have a bad hypo and your liver dumps, you're more likely to have a hypo in the next 24 hours?

I hope things have settled down a bit more today. 🙂
 
Thanks everyone, so much! Very quickly, now away until tuesday: another high, but not as bad in afternoon -- at least this means a pattern! So will adjust lunch ratio. Otherwise numbers decent today, and the one 11mmol (again) in the morning corrected well, so that's good.

Afternoon correction brought on hypo (ergh), but we are getting there I think.

Will let you know how weekend goes!

Thanks for all. Randomange -- nice to see you!

xxoo
 
A good weekend!

Hey all

Feel we have been gone *forever*, but really it was a good break with relatives and NO COOKING etc in Norwich...

E's numbers have actually been pretty darn good, with more hypos but general levels in green -- almost all of them! Considering that we forgot to bring scales and didn't want to make a deal of carb counting with ten people at every meal, things went well.

The extraordinary afternoon highs of last week seem to just be knocked on the head by a simple ratio change, from 1:11 to 1:10 -- incredible the difference. We also raised the late afternoon basal by 0.05u/per hour -- again, this minute shift seems to have made a tangible difference.

All in all, I think I'm right in remembering that he went into every single meal with a bgl that was IN TARGET! Heavens!

We did find that we had to react often to one-off situations, which I guess is natural and to be expected -- but again, this is the HUGE value of the pump as far as I can see:

-- Lots of 'unscheduled' exercise, eg swimming and football in the garden. In two out of three instances we remembered to put him on a 75% temp basal immediately after finishing. This seems like magic for him -- he stayed steady, and it's about the right amount of time. The one time we didn't remember to do the temp basal...see below!

-- Lots of late night, bitty eating. This is the one thing I found stressful about the weekend -- we had to test him every night at 12, sometimes 1 and then 3am -- because he'd had a late bolus for a pudding or whatever. The very first night we were so incredibly relieved we have a system in place for this: the 12am test showed 1.9 mmols 😱. We figured this was the result of a *very* light dinner, and we had overestimated the potatoes... With slug of apple juice, he was 8mmols at 1am, so okay in theory (see below!).

***

Problems and lessons

1. When we forgot to switch him to temp basal yesterday after an hour of football: an hour after lunch (at which he had TWO helpings of the difficult to dose strawbs!), he felt bad. 2.2mmols: carton apple juice. Ten minutes later, still felt rotten, tested 1.7 mmols: 2 glucose tabs and immediate switch to 75% temp basal. We were in the car by this point. Began to feel better, but he fought lows almost ALL afternoon, riding just above 4mmols. After two more hours of this, we switched him to 50% basal and he began to properly recover. Throughout, he ate LIKE A HORSE, and we underestimated carb the whole way, free carbing at least another 20 or 25 grams. Eek! Poor guy. Lesson: ALWAYS use temp basal with him with ANY exercise, and be prepared to be flexible in its use.

2. The first night there -- of 1.9mmols rising to 8mmols fame -- he ended up, to our surprise, waking on 3.8. He then spent the first half of the day with a headache and practically flat out on the sofa...Hmm. It was his first day off school, so this would contribute, but still, we ended up coming to the conclusion that despite our efforts he *must* have dropped again, or remained borderline low, for some of the night -- and he had suffered his first nighttime hypo-head. It was pretty miserable for him, though he didn't complain and we're not even sure if he clicked. He just rested. But we felt bad. We realised later that we should have used temp basal just to be certain -- which we did, even after lowering the nighttime basal rate, two nights later. On this night, he tested at 5.8mmols at 12am, but I could *not* wake him for love nor money to have some juice just to be sure (he was shattered). We then tested him at 3am. He was 4.4mmols. He could then be woken, had some juice, and just to be on the safe side, we put in a 75% temp for six hours. Unfortunately he woke on 14 -- but hey, you live and learn. The new nighttime rate is obviously a good one for him. With the juice he would have been fine til morning, no temp basal necessary. Lesson: again, be flexible with temp basal! Use it!

3. This lesson I feel we must all know: Chips are delicious but hellish. So on the way home we stop at the hell that is IKEA and have to eat, so he chooses the hell that is chips, and we decide to try the dual wave thing with them: 50/50 over three hours. Things are looking up at 10pm -- 7mmols, but by 11pm (hour after end of dual wave) he's at 3.8 -- damn. Treat and put on temp basal until 4am. At 3am he's risen to 16mmols! 😡 Chips, chips, I put a curse on you! Anyway, remove temp basal, give 2unit correction (UNDER dosing from wizard, which suggests 2.9units). This morning, good result: 5.7mmols.

***

We truly feel almost there, and where we are not there, we feel flexible. We want to be going into bedtime with more security, rather than up testing all the time, so we will try a night basal test I think once we settle down, to see if he remains steady throughout. We feel that we are at risk of 'feeding' the basal rate at night, since him *not* eating particularly well at night seems to risk him going low. We also may need to lower the 9pm-12am basal rate (having raised it earlier in the month!), so that he has a higher chance of being on 7 or 8 mmols at bedtime, rather than the 5-ish of the last few days.

It's obvious to us that some of the difficulty in the last two weeks is down to recovering the rates from France, and some is down to his changing needs. The late evening and night basal levels show this, as does the afternoon change: these changes actually revert him to some original levels of the pump, which *were* sending him into hypo-land...

Oh well. It's clear too that his needs actually *fluctuate*. They don't just increase, they also decrease, and differently in different times of day at different times....

Oh, and it's worth noting that he's not on the same pattern as he was at school: we have adjusted his weekend pump settings for his school holidays!

AND: Harry Potter 6 -- mixed reviews here! 😉

Hope everyone okay. I'll seek out others' threads.

Bev and Adrienne: hope A & J now feeling better? We are sneezy too, but have not gone down with anything...

Mand, Sugarbum: hope there is news on your threads...

xxoo
 
Hi Patricia,
I have missed your postings! Glad you had a nice break.🙂

I am learning regarding exercise and temp basals etc - sounds great to me. Yesterday A was cycling for 2 hours and it had a knock on effect right up until this morning, but on a pump, it sounds like its so much easier to manage (as long as your remember to do the temp basal!), i do hate feeding A biscuits and milk just to get him through the night, and trying to get him to eat a biscuit when he is sleepy is awful!

All this makes me desperate to get him pumping! Also, A is very insulin sensitive,even half a dose can send his levels haywire! So having the ability to do such small increments is truly amazing!

I am looking for a good log book as the one he has doesnt have enough room to log all the exercise and food etc - do you know of a good one? Ours was from the hospital and is very tatty now!

Harry Potter, we will have to wait util he has finished the tamiflu, but looking forward to it!🙂Bev
 
Bev, don't use a log book anymore, but do use a dietician sheet given us by our original person (well, not strictly true -- now use an excel spreadsheet which can handle all the pump settings, but *did* use the dietician sheets). If you pm me your email, I'll send it via attachment and you can use as you wish? We use it irregularly now, but still record food most times, and exercise...

Yes, exercise and the pump is kind of amazing. And waking a child to eat is pretty horrible. This used to happen *even if* we reduced the dose to try to take account of things...Sigh. Bring on the pump for A!
 
Bev, don't use a log book anymore, but do use a dietician sheet given us by our original person (well, not strictly true -- now use an excel spreadsheet which can handle all the pump settings, but *did* use the dietician sheets). If you pm me your email, I'll send it via attachment and you can use as you wish? We use it irregularly now, but still record food most times, and exercise...

Yes, exercise and the pump is kind of amazing. And waking a child to eat is pretty horrible. This used to happen *even if* we reduced the dose to try to take account of things...Sigh. Bring on the pump for A!

Hi Patricia

Great stuff, sounds like you are there now. You are confident to play with the temp basals and tweak without asking permission. You've got it and have now officially joined the club :D

One thing though, please don't beat yourself up with some things. You may never get it right for chips. We don't get it right for cinema popcorn, chipshop chips or jacket pot with beans and cheese. We have tried everything and so only have these things rarely and we deal with it as it happens.

The overnight thing : try for sensors. Seriously. You would not have had to do the 1 am and 3 am or whatever they were or at least the 3 am. Some nights I don't get up in the knowledge that the sensor will eventually siren and so wake me if a hypo is occuring. I do have a baby monitor though. The sensor however could wake E up. Jessica sleeps like a log and never wakes up. The sensors are, for me, all part and parcel or pumping and we would never do without them again, ever never never never. They are my security blanket 🙂
 
Hi Patricia
Welcome back! So glad you had a good break! Glad also that you really are on top of things generally.

Like Adrienne says, do not give yourself a hard time when things go a bit wonky because even when you do your very best, 'd' seems to have a life of its own and does odd things beyond your control!

The fantastic thing is that the pump makes all the blips so much easier to sort out.

I have certainly learnt from you about adjusting the basal rate. We need to work on this. I think we will need it during the school hols as he likely to be more active (well, he will be if this rain ever stops!).

Keep your posts coming please! I learning from you and it is good to know that someone else is going through the same thing.

Like you must be, i am a bit shattered due to the night testing. Hopefully will end soon!

Bye for now! 🙂 x 🙂
 
Hi all

Thanks for supportive words Adrienne and Mand! I think you might be right in that chips may be just one of those things...Oh well.

We also had a problem with pasta last night, which we haven't encountered before: at 3am again he was high, and still high this morning. We've been able to bring him down though, no problem -- so trying pasta again for lunch, a longer dual wave! We will crack this! What do you do again for pasta, Adrienne? We eat a lot of it, and it's one of his favourite things... I seem to remember you doing a temp basal?

We have also today tried the 'uncooked' measurement route, and it has shown what we think is a consistent under-dosing with pasta...so we will see. If he hypos all afternoon, then we've got it wrong again...

Except for the pasta weirdness, numbers continue to be stable and able to be managed. Nights troubling us (still!) in that we keep wanting a 'typical' night, to be sure where he is and track it through -- and we haven't had one in a while! So we continue to test...

Adrienne, yes -- we are able to get a sensor on our PCT package, and just haven't got ourselves to it yet. Some of the difficulty is that our pump training has come through another hospital -- whereas the sensor would be through our local team, so we haven't pursued it yet. But we know it's coming.

I'm sure you're right though. E is quite keen to try one, and that's half the battle I'm sure!

I'm not feeling so well today -- hot and cold, v ache-y, in and out of bed...rather hoping for swine flu so that everyone can be exposed before the damn thing mutates, but...nothing about it has been sudden, and I have no cough. Very dizzy though. Sigh.

For now!
 
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