Zero carbs? An appeal to low and very low carb members.

[Bruce Stephens]

I’m interested to know how you can do that without getting scurvy.

I suspect traditionally the diets would have included some plant material (wild berries, for example).

Until the introduction of citrus fruits into their diet (hence the nickname Limeys) British sailors succumbed to Vit C deficiency.

The story is more interesting and complex than it might appear. (You don't get scurvy quickly so you need fairly long sea journeys for it to be an issue. And drinking boiled orange or lime juices doesn't help, obviously.)

Cautionary Tales – South Pole Race: When Limeys get scurvy

Polar exploration is dangerous… but trudging hundreds of miles in subzero temperatures isn’t made any easier if you’re suffering from scurvy. The deadly vitamin deficiency destroy…

timharford.com

 

[Inka]

Humans are omnivores. We’re designed to eat a broad diet. The diet often touted as best is the Mediterranean Diet, which includes pasta, veg, pulses, etc.

Eating meat only isn’t sensible IMO nor is it how we evolved. If we were unthinking, instinctive animals we’d eat a variety of foods. We’re not lions.

No doubt we all do best on different amounts of carbs but that doesn’t mean no carbs. Not only is that unnecessary, I think it’s potentially risky long-term.

 

[Jodee]

I was watching a video on you tube about microbiome in the gut and the science study carried out by ZOE that those on low carb are more likely to get more serious symptoms if they get covid and the diet that has a diversity of plants 30+ a week, including, nuts grains and starchy vegetable faired better some not getting covid at all and some with very mild symptoms.

No one person will necessarily benefit from the same diet as the next person. I think eating the Rainbow is a very good idea.

I think zero carbs is not a good idea although as previously mentioned it would be very hard to achieve that if eating a healthy diet which included fruit and vegetables.

 

[Robin]

I suspect traditionally the diets would have included some plant material (wild berries, for example).

I’m sure you’re right. Berries and some roots, seaweeds and grasses for the Inuit, (admittedly according to a quick Google of a not very scientific site).

The story is more interesting and complex than it might appear. (You don't get scurvy quickly so you need fairly long sea journeys for it to be an issue. And drinking boiled orange or lime juices doesn't help, obviously.)

I was thinking of the days of Christopher Columbus etc, when you didn’t know where you were going, and might end up sailing (or being becalmed) for months without making landfall.

 

[Inka]

https://nutritionfacts.org/2018/07/12/the-eskimo-myth/

“In fact, going back more than a thousand years, we have frozen Eskimo mummies with atherosclerosis. From 500 years ago, a woman in her early 40s had atherosclerosis in her aorta and coronary arteries. And these aren’t just isolated cases. The totality of evidence from actual clinical investigations, autopsies, and imaging techniques is that they have the same plague of coronary artery disease that non-Eskimo populations have, and the Eskimo actually have twice the fatal stroke rate and don’t live particularly long.”

 

[Deleted member 21371]

I’m interested to know how you can do that without getting scurvy. Until the introduction of citrus fruits into their diet (hence the nickname Limeys) British sailors succumbed to Vit C deficiency. And what about Beriberi, caused by Vit B deficiency? Can you please tell me where you get your vitamins from? Do you take it in tablet form?

Very careful selection of the animals diet, and eating the meat raw does seem to preserve some vitamin C, so, technically it is possible in theory to maintain that.
Some B vitamins are present in raw liver as well.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

https://nutritionfacts.org/2018/07/12/the-eskimo-myth/

“In fact, going back more than a thousand years, we have frozen Eskimo mummies with atherosclerosis. From 500 years ago, a woman in her early 40s had atherosclerosis in her aorta and coronary arteries. And these aren’t just isolated cases. The totality of evidence from actual clinical investigations, autopsies, and imaging techniques is that they have the same plague of coronary artery disease that non-Eskimo populations have, and the Eskimo actually have twice the fatal stroke rate and don’t live particularly long.”

Fun fact.

"A new study has found that an Inuit population in Canada's Arctic are genetically distinct from any known group, and certain genetic variants are correlated with brain aneurysm. Geographically isolated populations often develop unique genetic traits that result from their successful adaptation to specific environments."

Although to be fair to Bulkbiker, his paper was from 1935, so it's more a historical document than any serious medical information.

 

[Robin]

Very careful selection of the animals diet, and eating the meat raw does seem to preserve some vitamin C, so, technically it is possible in theory to maintain that.
Some B vitamins are present in raw liver as well.

I think I'll pass on the raw meat, if you don’t mind.
So the poster I was replying to should specify RAW meat, salt and water as a complete diet?

 

[Bruce Stephens]

I was thinking of the days of Christopher Columbus etc, when you didn’t know where you were going, and might end up sailing (or being becalmed) for months without making landfall.

Yes, the basic story is apparently right, but there are wrinkles. I recommend the podcast I linked (and the other episodes), because the story is engaging.

 

[silentsquirrel]

I have just looked at the nutritional info on Tesco for pig's liver and it appears to be 3.1% carbs???

 

[42istheanswer]

I have just looked at the nutritional info on Tesco for pig's liver and it appears to be 3.1% carbs???

maybe the glycogen that the pig was storing to help it find its own breakfast?

 

[Deleted member 21371]

I have just looked at the nutritional info on Tesco for pig's liver and it appears to be 3.1% carbs???

Most organ meat has carbs in it.
It's probably why it's always been the most revered, and why true carnivores go for ripping the gut open first.
The stomach content of herbivores also has a lot of partially digested plant and fruit in it, again, a good source of food for obligate carnivores as they don't fully digest that themselves.

 

[Docb]

@everydayupsanddowns - I think it was a jolly good idea to split this off from the original thread. Just imagine the bewilderment in the OP's mind if all this had been left on their thread.

I would add that it is only in the worlds of politics and social media where everything has to be black or white. The real world operates in shades of grey and that the forum is at its best when posts reflect that notion.

 

[bulkbiker]

Ok,
for the sake of @bulkbiker.

"Toward the latter part of the test it became startlingly clear, on paper that we were not getting enough calcium for health. But we were healthy. The escape from that dilemma was assume that a calcium deficiency which did not hurt us in our one year might destroy us in ten or twenty."

Calcium deficiency, "startlingly clear" after one year, might be assumed to "destroy" @bulkbiker in ten to twenty years on an inuit meat only diet.
(If you fed Inuits western sheep and steak)

Not my sort of gamble Eddie.

But as you say, no one is going to tell you what to do.
In much the same way you can't tell us not to have our opinion on your suggestions.

And then further on .. again subtly ignored by your good self..

" You study bones when you look for a calcium deficiency. The thing to do then, was to examine the skeletons of people who had died at a reasonably high age after living from infancy upon an exclusive meat diet. Such skeletons are those of Eskimos who are known to have died before the European influences came in. The Institute of American Meat Packers were induced to make a subsidiary appropriation to the Peabody Museum of Harvard University where Dr. Earnest A. Hooton, Professor of Physical Anthropology, under took a through going study with regard to the calcium problem in the relation to the Museum's collection of the skeletons of meat eaters. Dr. Hooton reported no signs of calcium deficiency. On the contrary, there was every indication that the meat eaters had been liberally, or at least adequately, supplied. They had suffered no more in a lifetime from calcium deficiency than we had in our short year (really short, by the way for we enjoyed it)."

 

[bulkbiker]

I’m interested to know how you can do that without getting scurvy. Until the introduction of citrus fruits into their diet (hence the nickname Limeys) British sailors succumbed to Vit C deficiency. And what about Beriberi, caused by Vit B deficiency? Can you please tell me where you get your vitamins from? Do you take it in tablet form?

No, fresh meat contains vitamin C in suitable quantities for human health. The problems with scurvy came about through dried meat being all they had on the ships along with high carb ships biscuits.

 

[void]

I’m interested to know how you can do that without getting scurvy. Until the introduction of citrus fruits into their diet (hence the nickname Limeys) British sailors succumbed to Vit C deficiency. And what about Beriberi, caused by Vit B deficiency? Can you please tell me where you get your vitamins from? Do you take it in tablet form?

some most animals have the ability to store vitamin C, particularly in the liver spleen

 

[nonethewiser]

Something can be accurate/true but still silly.

Most people prefer to do more than just exist.

Well said that man/ woman.

Idea is not silly more like crazy, why miss out on delicious fruit & veggies even, life is about enjoyment & food is part of that, why restrict yourself more than you need to?

Balance is key to good heath, having crazy ideas & assumptions about food is no good for body or mind.

 

[Jodee]

@bulkbiker, I thought the post was about low carb you are talking bone density now!

Its a good thing we are not all deficient diet sailors back in the day of scurvy and now we have access to so much nutrient rich food sources.

Even the hunter gatherers ate nuts berries, eggs, fish and animal flesh, they would have faired better than those poor sailors as far as diet goes.

 

[bulkbiker]

@bulkbiker, I thought the post was about low carb you are talking bone density now!

Its a good thing we are not all deficient diet sailors back in the day of scurvy and now we have access to so much nutrient rich food sources.

Even the hunter gatherers ate nuts berries, eggs, fish and animal flesh, they would have faired better than those poor sailors as far as diet goes.

I am simply explaining how selective quoting by @travellor can be perceived as being misleading.

That's why it was a reply to what he posted (assuming he is a "he" of course)

 

[bulkbiker]

https://nutritionfacts.org/2018/07/12/the-eskimo-myth/

“In fact, going back more than a thousand years, we have frozen Eskimo mummies with atherosclerosis. From 500 years ago, a woman in her early 40s had atherosclerosis in her aorta and coronary arteries. And these aren’t just isolated cases. The totality of evidence from actual clinical investigations, autopsies, and imaging techniques is that they have the same plague of coronary artery disease that non-Eskimo populations have, and the Eskimo actually have twice the fatal stroke rate and don’t live particularly long.”

Vegan propaganda sorry .. I think that's based on 2 or 3 mummies..