Covid-19 response

[Amity Island]

I don't know. I'd guess the evidence for hand washing is just better (and presumably had an impact on public health generally). I presume the common cold unit studied it at some point (on colds), and I guess didn't find it that helpful?

Yet; they were more than happy to mandate things like masks without any official w.h.o evidence they reduced transmission for the general public (in the real world) during a respiratory virus pandemic and use lockdowns which were also contrary to the w.h.o advice and ruined the country for generations to come.

Of course, masks and lockdowns cannot be considered an existing/known treatment for covid, thus "they" can be "seen" to be doing "something" about the pandemic, but without preventing the ability to use the "emergency authorisation only" products later down the line. Any alternative effective treatment would have prevented the roll out of the novel jabs.

Strange that nobody was encouraged to use such a simple (salt rinse) treatment during the entire pandemic, be it at home or in hospital or care home. At virtually no cost, effort or time, this should of been the most obvious treatment to roll out.

 

[Satan’s little helper]

I don't know. I'd guess the evidence for hand washing is just better (and presumably had an impact on public health generally). I presume the common cold unit studied it at some point (on colds), and I guess didn't find it that helpful?

I rarely if at all get sore throats. But have gargled salt water. I can’t see how salt water could stop anyone contagious with anything from infecting others or slow the natural progression between the “virus” & the antibodies fighting it off?

I’ve also heard this too.. Under the guise of “stopping contraction of C19??” (Seriously. From a member of “Joe public.) https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34328284/

 

[Satan’s little helper]

Yet; they were more than happy to mandate things like masks without any official w.h.o evidence they reduced transmission for the general public (in the real world) during a respiratory virus pandemic and use lockdowns which were also contrary to the w.h.o advice and ruined the country for generations to come.

Of course, masks and lockdowns cannot be considered an existing/known treatment for covid, thus "they" can be "seen" to be doing "something" about the pandemic, but without preventing the ability to use the "emergency authorisation only" products later down the line. Any alternative effective treatment would have prevented the roll out of the novel jabs.

Strange that nobody was encouraged to use such a simple (salt rinse) treatment during the entire pandemic, be it at home or in hospital or care home. At virtually no cost, effort or time, this should of been the most obvious treatment to roll out.

Dare I say it. There is a certain view on the world (in my experience.) from people that dismissed the use of masks. It was based on a “proud cultural heritage and colonial rhetoric.”
“It’s something they do over there, not in this sceptered isle.”

This is my take on it.

I bench tested masks. The idea was to stop the percussive in speech (or defuse it.) so if you were a shop keeper? My, “Pound of Bacon Please?” Would less likely blow my “germ” in your face. 😉

It acts like a “pop shield” in a music studio.

It’s also being kind.

 

[Amity Island]

Dare I say it. There is a certain view on the world (in my experience.) from people that dismissed the use of masks. It was based on a “proud cultural heritage and colonial rhetoric.”
“It’s something they do over there, not in this sceptered isle.”

This is my take on it.

I bench tested masks. The idea was to stop the percussive in speech (or defuse it.) so if you were a shop keeper? My, “Pound of Bacon Please?” Would less likely blow my “germ” in your face. 😉

It acts like a “pop shield” in a music studio.

It’s also being kind.

The difference in mask effectiveness is between in lab controlled environments and real world on the street public use. Prior to 2020 the w.h.o pandemic preparedness document made it clear there was no evidence that masks worn at a population level reduced transmission.

Of course I wore a mask as required during the pandemic.

The study posted is about reducing symptoms, hospitalization by using a salt water rinse, it doesn't make any claim about preventing transmission. It was claimed by the health secretary that covid was the greatest threat to our health this nation has faced, yet, no recommendation for using salt water rinse (shown to reduce hospitalization by up to 40%). It's been claimed throughout, there was no treatment for covid19.

 

[Dragonheart]

The difference in mask effectiveness is between in lab controlled environments and real world on the street public use. Prior to 2020 the w.h.o pandemic preparedness document made it clear there was no evidence that masks worn at a population level reduced transmission.

Of course I wore a mask as required during the pandemic.

The study posted is about reducing symptoms, hospitalization by using a salt water rinse, it doesn't make any claim about preventing transmission. It was claimed by the health secretary that covid was the greatest threat to our health this nation has faced, yet, no recommendation for using salt water rinse (shown to reduce hospitalization by up to 40%). It's been claimed throughout, there was no treatment for covid19.

“No evidence - yet” is quite different to “proof it doesn’t work”. There been plenty since then that shows it does help if worn correctly and used the right materials. It simply hadn’t been tested at that point in time.

Just imagine if the first bit of advice was about wearing decent quality masks, in the right way, rather than singing happy birthday and telling people not to bother with masks (more about the shortages at the time than the effectiveness in all likelihood). The problem is the first thing someone hears about an issue is the message that sticks - no matter what evidence follows.

I would agree a mitigation, if it were known about at the time and known to be helpful, should have been shared.

Sadly there were plenty of people that didn’t like the mitigations that were put in place. Would this have been any different? “I don’t like salt”, “salt will give me high blood pressure”, “it’s a con and will do nothing”, “why should I put up with the unpleasant taste even if it helps others” would all have been cries from the entitled section of society that whinged about other measures that aimed to protect other people.

The most important one of all - clean fresh air - is still being ignored and would benefit in many more ways than just covid, reduce overall sickness and absence, increase alertness and well being. Oh actually, the Houses of Parliament have a super dooper air filtration system even when schools and hospitals don’t

 

[Amity Island]

“No evidence - yet” is quite different to “proof it doesn’t work”. There been plenty since then that shows it does help if worn correctly and used the right materials. It simply hadn’t been tested at that point in time.

Just imagine if the first bit of advice was about wearing decent quality masks, in the right way, rather than singing happy birthday and telling people not to bother with masks (more about the shortages at the time than the effectiveness in all likelihood). The problem is the first thing someone hears about an issue is the message that sticks - no matter what evidence follows.

I would agree a mitigation, if it were known about at the time and known to be helpful, should have been shared.

Sadly there were plenty of people that didn’t like the mitigations that were put in place. Would this have been any different? “I don’t like salt”, “salt will give me high blood pressure”, “it’s a con and will do nothing”, “why should I put up with the unpleasant taste even if it helps others” would all have been cries from the entitled section of society that whinged about other measures that aimed to protect other people.

The most important one of all - clean fresh air - is still being ignored and would benefit in many more ways than just covid, reduce overall sickness and absence, increase alertness and well being. Oh actually, the Houses of Parliament have a super dooper air filtration system even when schools and hospitals don’t

I'm sure that if they'd managed to coerce (mandates, job loss, fear, do it for others, only inform people of the more convincing 95% effectiveness rather than the 1.5% absolute effectiveness etc etc) and convince billions of people to inject a novel substance, I'm fairly certain these same people would of happily rinsed their mouths with a salt water rinse.

 

[Bruce Stephens]

rinsed their mouths with a salt water rinse

And nasal irrigation, 4 times daily? I'm less confident. I'm not that confident people (including me) actually did hand washing as prescribed, and that's way simpler.

 

[Amity Island]

And nasal irrigation, 4 times daily? I'm less confident. I'm not that confident people (including me) actually did hand washing as prescribed, and that's way simpler.

People wouldn't rinse their mouths and nose for a few days if they caught covid?

 

[Dragonheart]

People wouldn't rinse their mouths and nose for a few days if they caught covid?

There are plenty happy to sneeze and cough all over everyone when they have any virus. So yes I think many would refuse to do nasal irrigation too.

 

[Amity Island]

There are plenty happy to sneeze and cough all over everyone when they have any virus. So yes I think many would refuse to do nasal irrigation too.

Yes, but that would be their choice if they didn't want to reduce their own symptoms and chances of being hospitalised (it's up to you if you want to take your insulin each day). The alternative is what actually happened, which is no treatment was made available for anyone, be it at home, hospital or care home during that first year of the pandemic.

So why was this not made available or recommended or even discussed when people were getting really poorly with covid? As I said before, any available treatment would of meant no novel mrna vaccines.

 

[Dragonheart]

So why was this not made available or recommended or even discussed when people were getting really poorly with covid? As I said before, any available treatment would have meant no novel mrna vaccines.

Did they know this at the time or has the evidence only been identified now? If it were known or suspected then I agree it should have been shared, providing any risks or precautions were also shared. I do remember reading something about it a long time back but that would not have been from official sources, more likely community based speculation about what might work or help somewhat - which was full of ideas some of which had validity others were nothing short of crackpot.

Not necessarily. Any treatments might well need to have been demonstrably effective for enough of the population to have avoided the development of vaccines.

 

[Amity Island]

Did they know this at the time or has the evidence only been identified now?

Salt rinse is an age old remedy, used for thousands of years. It's not new or just invented. No different from informing people to cover their mouth if you cough or sneeze. It's really basic stuff.

I've been listening to the strawman claims throughout the pandemic about "we don't know" "there is no evidence" etc about things like duration of immunity etc. Yes, they couldn't measure the length of protection until after the event, but they sure has hell knew it was more than likely that the human body develops immunity, and they sure as hell knew that its not the antibodies that are the marker for long term immunity but the T -cells, every doctor, nurse, medic, g.p knows this. They claimed nobody had any prior immunity, which was also not true. They mandated masks without any evidence, they mandated lockdowns against w.h.o advice. They brought in covid passports, when the vaccines were never developed to prevent transmission and when people who were vaccinated were still catching and transmitting covid. They chose a novel vaccine over traditional vaccines which are known to prevent outbreaks. They locked in well people.

As you quite rightly said “No evidence - yet” is quite different to “proof it doesn’t work”, this can be applied to acquired immunity too about duration of T-cells!

Everything was either down played (natural immunity, possible treatments) or over exaggerated (every death a covid death if testing positive within 28 days, a positive test is a "case" of covid, you can have covid even if you don't have covid), during the pandemic. Covid (corona virus disease) is an actual disease (not just a virus flying around in the air) which has specific symptoms, yet; they were telling people they had covid when they were well!

 

[Amity Island]

In U.S, Soldiers (Young, fit and healthy people) who were actually sacked for not wanting to take the novel vaccines are now being offered their jobs back, with their records to be corrected.

The Army is Begging Unvaccinated Soldiers to Return

Army forced to reverse course, as people refuse to enlist

www.igor-chudov.com

 

[Amity Island]

The Society of Actuaries released an updated report on deaths during the pandemic that shows what really slayed Covid. It wasn't the vaccines, it was omicron, just as Bill Gates had previously said.

The mRNAs didn’t end Covid, Omicron did

The proof in one amazing chart

alexberenson.substack.com

 

[Amity Island]

More truth coming out about the pandemic.

'There is no such thing as "the" science': Sir Patrick Vallance tells Covid Inquiry ministers were 'completely wrong' to hide behind the term 'following the science' during pandemic

'There is no such thing as

Sir Patrick Vallance, the UK Government's former Chief Scientific Adviser, kept a diary during the pandemic, which has been described as 'a brain dump' written 'at the end of immensely stressful days'.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Amity Island]

Prof Sir Jonathan Van Tam (former deputy chief medical officer) said that the first he heard of Rishi Sunak's Eat Out to Help Out Scheme was on the TV.

Patrick Vallance said: “We didn’t see it before it was announced, and I think others in the Cabinet Office also said they didn’t see it before it was formulated as policy. So we weren’t involved in the run-up to it.”

I first heard about Eat Out to Help Out on TV, says Van-Tam

Prof Sir Jonathan Van Tam said that the first he heard of the Eat Out to Help Out Scheme was on the TV.

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[MikeyBikey]

So why didn't Sir Johnathan and Sir Patrick speak up at the time - probably to protect heir big fat inflation linked pensions. They should be ashamed of themselves, hand the Knighthoods back and be awarded the "Order of the Brown Nose!".

 

[Amity Island]

So why didn't Sir Johnathan and Sir Patrick speak up at the time - probably to protect heir big fat inflation linked pensions. They should be ashamed of themselves, hand the Knighthoods back and be awarded the "Order of the Brown Nose!".

It looks like nobody of any medical background knew until it was announced on t.v.

We can see on this graph that just before the eat out to help scheme was brought out in Aug 2020, covid cases were falling dramatically. If that downward trend in cases had been allowed to continue, they wouldn't have been able do further lockdowns, which in turn encourage people to get jabbed. It was only by taking away peoples liberties, freedom to travel, to see family, rather than allowing people to manage their own risks that would encourage people to get jabbed. I know many who took the jab solely for these reasons and not because they thought they were at particular risk from the virus.

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

We can see on this graph that just before the eat out to help scheme was brought out in Aug 2020, covid cases were falling dramatically. If that downward trend in cases had been allowed to continue, they wouldn't have been able do further lockdowns,

But doesn’t the rise in cases that (inevitably) followed the Eat Out to Help Out scheme also demonstrate the increase in transmission when people showing no symptoms of the virus are encouraged to get out and about and meet and mingle together.

The fact that the scheme seems to have been kept from Van Tam and Vallance, who say they would definitely have advised against if they had been consulted, seems very deliberate to me.

Eat Out was surely an attempt to pacify some voices in the Conservative party who were more worried about the economy than they were about the risks of transmission of the virus between people who thought they ‘were fine’ (or just didn’t care).

It was an arrogant risk. It felt like a risk at the time to me. And it massively backfired, leading to more dramatic measures being required in my opinion.

 

[MikeyBikey]

It looks like nobody of any medical background knew until it was announced on t.v.

We can see on this graph that just before the eat out to help scheme was brought out in Aug 2020, covid cases were falling dramatically. If that downward trend in cases had been allowed to continue, they wouldn't have been able do further lockdowns, which in turn encourage people to get jabbed. It was only by taking away peoples liberties, freedom to travel, to see family, rather than allowing people to manage their own risks that would encourage people to get jabbed. I know many who took the jab solely for these reasons and not because they thought they were at particular risk from the virus.

I think my point still stans even if they only found out in the TV! If they were not lacking in moral fibre and backbone they would have spoken up at the time. Surely Sunak's time as PM is limited! Threw of the four people I knew that died of COVID died at the end of 2020 or early 2021!