You're invited this wednesday

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Peter C said:
Yes John, like I jokingly posted when the experiment was first proposed. the list (spagbol, fishn chips, pizza,fajitas) looked more like a "suicide note" for most T2s rather than a menu 🙂
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The point of doing the experiment with such 'spikey' foods was to try to work out ways in which to lessen the spike. I have learnt a lot doing this as have others. I do understand that for a type 2 who is not insulin dependant it is a lot harder to keep levels under control - but this is exactly what Steph has found out - that pizza causes high levels that she cant control on her meds - so I am sure she will now keep clear of pizza - i would consider this a success!🙂

All this information on how to dose for such 'spikey' foods is invaluable for an 11 year old - he will now *know* how to dose for it for the future - this can only be a good thing! He wont eat pizza every night - perhaps once a month - but at least we now know how to dose for it properly (well it does need a bit of tweaking) and this has to be a bonus! Knowledge is power and all that....

I am not sure why fajhitas are considered so bad? Chicken breast, salad, chilli, and a wholemeal wrap - hardly 'suicide' food'. It is not for me to choose the menu every week - I just started the ball rolling as it were - do feel free to put forward your own choices and I am sure a lot more type 2's will take part.🙂Bev
 
Well said Bev! I learned a lot also, and it was interesting seeing the other figures from people. I think it would be great if one of our Typw 2 people put forward one of their 'no spike' menus - it would be interesting to see what happens when you're not equipped with an automatic insulin response but have to match peaks (even if they are small peaks!). I'm not thinking of no-carb, but something low GI.
 
Mand said:
Hi Bev and all

My son had Sainsbury's pizza for tea last night.
(Pizza base, tomato sauce, ham, pinapple and cheese)
31.7 per 100g carb

Pre-meal blood 6.9

Bolused 8.9 of insulin for pizza

1 hr later = 4.8
2hr later = 3.5 (gave 100ml apple juice as felt hypo)
3 hr later = 9 (did not give a correction as wanted to see if continued to rise)
4 hr later = 9.5 (did not give a correction as wanted to see if still rising)
5 hr later = 8.5 (did not give correction as it was almost mignight and thought
this an ok number to go through the night on)
Woke this morning on 11.5

My thoughts on above
Went low to start with due to insulin peaking before pizza digested? But was surprised he did not go higher than 9.5 later.
Was the 11.5 this morning due to him rising even more due to the pizza after midnight? Although i cant imagine so as he had clearly began to come down. Or just one of those things? he does occassionally wake up on a higher than expected number.

I presume a dual wave would be good next time he has pizza to stop the low? But what ratio?

Your thoughts?
What do you think? Any advice/thoughts would be very welcome.

Mand x 🙂
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Mand,
I would try a 50/50 dual wave over 5 hours next time - i always start with 50/50 and then tweak! Numbers arent too bad considering you gave it all in one go! 🙂Bev
 
bev said:
The point of doing the experiment with such 'spikey' foods was to try to work out ways in which to lessen the spike. I have learnt a lot doing this as have others. I do understand that for a type 2 who is not insulin dependant it is a lot harder to keep levels under control -

Careful - you might get banned 😉

but this is exactly what Steph has found out - that pizza causes high levels that she cant control on her meds - so I am sure she will now keep clear of pizza - i would consider this a success!🙂

Steph knew she couldn't cope with pizzas. her participation was like what Doc. Johnson said of second marriages ," The triumph of hope over experience".🙂

All this information on how to dose for such 'spikey' foods is invaluable for an 11 year old - he will now *know* how to dose for it for the future - this can only be a good thing! He wont eat pizza every night - perhaps once a month - but at least we now know how to dose for it properly (well it does need a bit of tweaking) and this has to be a bonus! Knowledge is power and all that....


Actually I was disappointed by some of the pumping results over the last few experiments. I thought the pump would give much tighter control than reported. Of course kids have to be given freer rein to avoid hypos that could damage the growing brain.

I am not sure why fajhitas are considered so bad? Chicken breast, salad, chilli, and a wholemeal wrap - hardly 'suicide' food'.
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Course it isn't - if you are the average T2 and you leave out the fajita🙂
 
Well as in life i have experienced the downside of diabetes r.e the pizza i will not go back there again.LESSON LEARNT.
 
Actually I was disappointed by some of the pumping results over the last few experiments. I thought the pump would give much tighter control than reported. Of course kids have to be given freer rein to avoid hypos that could damage the growing brain.

Peter,
Alex's hba1c was 9.6 when he was last tested on MDI. After just 2 months it had gone down to 8. I am fairly sure that we will achieve much better than this at his next revue. It is extremely difficult to achieve a good hba1c in children. They have growth hormones and periods of pure excitement and adrenalin rushes that sometimes cant be 'caught' using either MDI or the pump - they are unpredictable and therefore make life with type 1 diabetes extremely hard to handle.:(

He has been on the pump for 5 months now and I am happy to report that it is 100% better than MDI. As I have experience of both I am able to give you the benefit of my experience.🙂I/he would never go back to MDI. You say that control doesnt seem as tight as you thought it would be - I cant tell you that if Alex had eaten a pizza on MDI he would have risen to 18 or 20 - so I can happily say that we have much better control than we did on MDI.
Parents/carers and diabetics work very hard to get better control and I dont think it is very encouraging to be quite so critical about peoples results. We are just doing the best we can and trying to get things better - hence the experiment. We will all learn something from this and hopefully all gain better control.🙂It is much better to find ways of helping people and ultimately gaining better control than it is to be critical of their efforts.🙂Bev
 
bev said:
Actually I was disappointed by some of the pumping results over the last few experiments. I thought the pump would give much tighter control than reported. Of course kids have to be given freer rein to avoid hypos that could damage the growing brain.

Peter,
Parents/carers and diabetics work very hard to get better control and I dont think it is very encouraging to be quite so critical about peoples results. We are just doing the best we can and trying to get things better - hence the experiment. We will all learn something from this and hopefully all gain better control.🙂It is much better to find ways of helping people and ultimately gaining better control than it is to be critical of their efforts.🙂Bev
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Bev,
you are entirely misrepresenting what I said. I was not critical of any one's efforts simply expressing an opinion about the overall numbers resulting from the pump in gereral. And I SPECIFICALLY let the kids on pumps out of my comments.
Having read and heard a lot about pumps I was expecting to see even /balanced numbers flowing along through the experiments and after. But that didn't seem to be the case.
 
Peter,
I apologise if i have misinterpretted what you meant. There were only 3 'pump' results as i recall and 2 of them were for children. So i had assumed you were putting everyone into one boat so to speak. I do think it is worth remembering that a pump is only as good as the person who is operating it. There is so much evidence that pumps can and do give better control than other methods for type 1's - but as I say its only as good as the person who is operating it. So if this experiment helps us pumpers to learn better and more effective ways of gaining better control then that has to be a good thing in my book.🙂Bev
 
Thanks Bev. I have kept a record of bloods from last night and have made a note of your suggestion. Next time he has pizza I will try your suggestion and then tweak it, if necessary, for another time.

Mand x x 🙂
 
I shall be adding my numbers tomorrow night, one I've had the darn pizza, I am tempted to split the dose my several hours!!
 
Peter C said:
The point of doing the experiment with such 'spikey' foods was to try to work out ways in which to lessen the spike. I have learnt a lot doing this as have others. I do understand that for a type 2 who is not insulin dependant it is a lot harder to keep levels under control -

Careful - you might get banned
...
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If only what Bev said was ANYTHING like the horrible, senseless comment you made about type 1 diabetes, I would consider you a most decent chap. (Something I could almost see through your cynical posts prior to the disgusting statement you made).

Peter C said:
Bev,
you are entirely misrepresenting what I said. I was not critical of any one's efforts simply expressing an opinion about the overall numbers resulting from the pump in gereral. And I SPECIFICALLY let the kids on pumps out of my comments.
Having read and heard a lot about pumps I was expecting to see even /balanced numbers flowing along through the experiments and after. But that didn't seem to be the case.
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Welcome to Type 1 diabetes. Type 1 Diabetes is VERY difficult to control in most cases. Oh wait, just like Type 2 Diabetes. Diabetes is a really nasty condition all round, don't you think Peter?
 
katie said:
If only what Bev said was ANYTHING like the horrible, senseless comment you made about type 1 diabetes, I would consider you a most decent chap. (Something I could almost see through your cynical posts prior to the disgusting statement you made).



Welcome to Type 1 diabetes. Type 1 Diabetes is VERY difficult to control in most cases. Oh wait, just like Type 2 Diabetes. Diabetes is a really nasty condition all round, don't you think Peter?
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Well said katie. What bev said was hardly offensive. However, Peter's comments about it being 'suicide food' and every other thing like that is just insensitive and nasty :(

Katie is right Peter, we are ALL diabetics in this together.

Now the only reason I didn't take part in this experiment is through the sheer fact that I didn't have the food in. Else I would. It's a very interesting experiment to see what food spikes and when. Type 2 or no. And as steff has already said, because of this experiment she knows now to avoid pizza in future.
 
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God i'm so dyslexic. My first sentence is all out of sequence, but I hope you see what i'm saying 😉

If your comment was anything like Bev's, it would be perfectly fine.
 
Diabetes anonymous...

Hi.... my name is Karina and I'm a Type 2 diabetic......

(pauses for choruses of "Hi Karina", "welcome" etc..,)

I haven't taken part in the food experiments for the following reasons:

Spag bol - love it but was too lazy/tired to make it as I get home from work at 8pm and need something v fast (ready meal versions are sh*t)

Fish and chips - was a possible but since I started eating healthier, am no longer able to stomach it (doesn't taste the same.. too fatty..) which is a real pity coz I used to love it..

Pizza - childhood aversion to cheese, esp melted cheese..

Not sure about the fajitas - hate salsa and guacemole.

So - I will watch with interest for future meal experiments and will happily join in if able. It's really interesting for me to see how we all react so differently to different types of food. Was that not one of the points to the experiment? An information gathering exercise? A totally, voluntary, information gathering exercise?

Karina
 
karinagal said:
Hi.... my name is Karina and I'm a Type 2 diabetic......

(pauses for choruses of "Hi Karina", "welcome" etc..,)

I haven't taken part in the food experiments for the following reasons:

Spag bol - love it but was too lazy/tired to make it as I get home from work at 8pm and need something v fast (ready meal versions are sh*t)

Fish and chips - was a possible but since I started eating healthier, am no longer able to stomach it (doesn't taste the same.. too fatty..) which is a real pity coz I used to love it..

Pizza - childhood aversion to cheese, esp melted cheese..

Not sure about the fajitas - hate salsa and guacemole.

So - I will watch with interest for future meal experiments and will happily join in if able. It's really interesting for me to see how we all react so differently to different types of food. Was that not one of the points to the experiment? An information gathering exercise? A totally, voluntary, information gathering exercise?

Karina
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Yup its for us as individuals to get from it whatever we desire,for me it is to see what foods i avoid and which are ok, for others it is just watching o see what it does to everyones level, all i knwo is it was a great idea from bev.
 
I agree - it's a great idea and a very worthwhile experiment. I will continue to monitor it with interest!
 
Peter C said:
you are entirely misrepresenting what I said. I was not critical of any one's efforts simply expressing an opinion about the overall numbers resulting from the pump in gereral. And I SPECIFICALLY let the kids on pumps out of my comments.
Having read and heard a lot about pumps I was expecting to see even /balanced numbers flowing along through the experiments and after. But that didn't seem to be the case.
Click to expand...

I think I'm the other pumper (other than the kids) who's taking part in this so far, although I may be wrong. I'd just like to say that I don't think I should be taken as representative of pumpers, as I've been on the pump less than a month and I'm still very much in the adjusting and sorting things out phase! 😱 It's one of the reason I'm finding these experiments very useful, as it's a huge learning experience for me in dealing with these kinds of spiky foods on the pump as compared to MDI. 🙂
 
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