Learning by experience

[Robin]

I always think that if i eat too much carby stuff and obviously there is an increase in sugar levels. Once in a while (and I mean once in a while( over a lifetime of diabetes it won't make too much difference to me. Am I being naive in this belief? Or is diabetes way cleverer then me?

Once in a while, I think it’s more important to go with the moment than worry about glucose levels. I had hot cross buns for lunch with no opportunity to pre bolus. (you can see the spike, we ate at 1pm) Making a song and dance about it would have ruined the family get together. Tomorrow is another day.

 

[IrvineHimself]

On way, did not feel right - head swimming a bit.

Had a similar experience today: After an early start and being out all day, I gave into temptation and had a scrambled egg sandwich made with chapati bread from Starbucks. It is the first time I have eaten bread in almost a year, and, within about half an hour, my head was swimming and I definitely did not feel right at all. At one point, I even thought I was having another TIA!

It cleared up pretty quickly, within about an hour. So, it was unlikely to have been a stroke, but I will definitely not be eating another sandwich in the foreseeable future.

I do not use BG meters (they would be playing into my OCD) so I have no idea what my levels were, but oh man did I feel off. Over Easter I think this could be a real problem for some members.


Edited:
To change "for members" to "for some members"

 

[Deleted member 21371]

I always think that if i eat too much carby stuff and obviously there is an increase in sugar levels. Once in a while (and I mean once in a while( over a lifetime of diabetes it won't make too much difference to me. Am I being naive in this belief? Or is diabetes way cleverer then me?

I'm100% behind you on this.
Diabetes can ruin your life.
But, it's insidious.
You can play into its hands in many ways.
Once you start chasing BG readings, the "four club", the Hba1c of "low thirties", for me, diabetes has taken over.
You are being way cleverer than diabetes.
For me, no complications, all bloods where they should be, and I am more than happy to age disgracefully.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Once in a while, I think it’s more important to go with the moment than worry about glucose levels. I had hot cross buns for lunch with no opportunity to pre bolus. (you can see the spike, we ate at 1pm) Making a song and dance about it would have ruined the family get together. Tomorrow is another day.
View attachment 25236

That's the thing for me.
I'm Type 2.
But I did post up asking for anyone as a type 1 to respond with time in range, spikes, complications, and it was interesting to understand how there was a good spread if results.
There are possibly type 2 zealots that may be scared, or may be over protective?

 

[bulkbiker]

Diabetes can ruin your life.

Which is precisely why it's best to keep it well controlled.

Once you start chasing BG readings, the "four club", the Hba1c of "low thirties", for me, diabetes has taken over.

I regard it as having taken charge of my own health which is far more important to me than anyone else

There are possibly type 2 zealots that may be scared, or may be over protective?

"T2 zealots"
I guess you mean people that are concerned enough about their own health to have done something about it?
Odd way of phrasing it though.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Which is precisely why it's best to keep it well controlled.


I regard it as having taken charge of my own health which is far more important to me than anyone else


"T2 zealots"
I guess you mean people that are concerned enough about their own health to have done something about it?
Odd way of phrasing it though.

Nah

 

[Docb]

Well, perhaps we should not get too hung up on preconceived ideas and private prejudices. My post lunch reading yesterday and post breakfast this morning are both into double figures, 2-3 higher than I would have expected.

I have also developed a dreadful cold.

One of these days I might introduce you to the work of Genichi Taguchi.

 

[IrvineHimself]

One of these days I might introduce you to the work of Genichi Taguchi.

Vary interesting, I wonder to what extent he was responsible for the Japanese dominance of manufacturing during the 60's, and 70's?

I have previously read that, in the case of Germany, their rise to dominance is explained by the RAF having flattened their manufacturing base, thus requiring it to be completely re-tooled with 'modern' equipment, (cf the UK, which, even in the 80's, was still using machine tools that pre-dated the 1st World War!) Anyway, I always assumed that a similar analysis applied to Japan.

 

[Docb]

Vary interesting, I wonder to what extent he was responsible for the Japanese dominance of manufacturing during the 60's, and 70's?

Yes, he was one of the engineer/statisticians whose work heavily influenced Japanese manufacturing.

Fundamental to his methods was the notion that in any system there are a multiplicity of variables that may influence the outcome. Some are obvious and some are not, but rarely do they interact. What his method required was identification of any likely variables by talking to all concerned in the process, from the designers, the managers, and those lowly souls who actually operated the plant. Having got a set of variables, statistically designed experiments in which all the variables were changed were carried out. Far more efficient than the changing one thing at a time approach and far more effective than only looking at the boss's prejudices about what was important. Although the theory was complicated the inputs and outputs could be interpreted by almost anybody and it was easy to get people to buy into recommendations made by the testing.

We used the method a lot and at one point I devised a QA system based on it. One interesting thing I do remember was setting up a Taguchi experiment on a piece of very expensive piece of main frame fluid dynamics software - its main selling point was that it could introduce randomness into the calculations. Gave some very odd answers which proved to be a result of a random number generator in the software not actually generating random numbers! Sort of stuffed its main selling point.

When it comes to T2 diabetes what Taguchi taught me that there is merit in everybodys view point when trying to work out how a system was behaving. Its strength was to circumvent the human tendency of defending to the death their position as being the only important thing to consider. Systems, even bodily systems, pay no heed to operator prejudice.

At least with an inhuman system you could set up experiments to evaluate the variables and a skilled practitioner could get otherwise warring factions to reach a consensus. It is too far in my past to consider what might be done in using those methods to look at T2 diabetes and getting an agreed perspective what are the best ways forward. I also suspect that experimenting on humans rather than inanimate plants might make things a bit tricky, if not impossible.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Well, perhaps we should not get too hung up on preconceived ideas and private prejudices. My post lunch reading yesterday and post breakfast this morning are both into double figures, 2-3 higher than I would have expected.

I have also developed a dreadful cold.

One of these days I might introduce you to the work of Genichi Taguchi.

I spent many years using Japanese process and quality control.
Taguchi was actually very helpful to finalise how I was going to treat my diabetes.

I took the view my body was the issue, not diabetes
I dealt with the many interactions, and chose an outcome that satisfied the end result I chose, which was very lifestyle based.

The problem with trying to find a general fix is that many have a different view of the problem, a different view of the process, and a different desired outcome.

So my process is totally different to others, because I wanted a different outcome to some others, and fundamentally the processes are completely incompatible.

Whether there will one day be a 'magic bullet" or not, there will still be those that wouldn't take it, so again we are dealing with a process that actually fights back regardless.

 

[Docb]

It is the human element that interferes with everything. I doubt if there will ever be a "magic bullet" but it would be nice to think that moving forward we will get much more targeted recommendations.

By the way, my BGs have remained a couple of points above what I would normally expect over the last couple of days, a couple of post meal tests going over 12 and taking a bit longer than normal to come down. The cold is just going into the chesty cough stage and has slowed me down to a near standstill. Maybe it was the early stages of the cold that gave the higher BG levels and all that speculation about rolls and gravy was for the birds!

 

[Deleted member 21371]

It is the human element that interferes with everything. I doubt if there will ever be a "magic bullet" but it would be nice to think that moving forward we will get much more targeted recommendations.

By the way, my BGs have remained a couple of points above what I would normally expect over the last couple of days, a couple of post meal tests going over 12 and taking a bit longer than normal to come down. The cold is just going into the chesty cough stage and has slowed me down to a near standstill. Maybe it was the early stages of the cold that gave the higher BG levels and all that speculation about rolls and gravy was for the birds!

I believe there will be.
Look back at how things have changed in ten years, look back at a hundred.
Mankind is very inventive.

You may be right on the cold.
BG always rises to fight off infections.

 

[IrvineHimself]

Only because we are still mildly connected to the subject of Taguchi: When I was out taking my morning walk, I gave a bit of thought to the question of his contribution to Japanese manufacturing dominance, and remembered how in the late 50's, early 60's their "trannies" were a technological marvel, but their quality control was a real joke. Even as an apprentice in the early 70's our instructors would deride Japanese quality control. At the same time, off the shelf Japanese bikes were starting to seriously out perform their British rivals. The thing is, this type of high performance engine tuning requires superb mastery of quality control.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Only because we are still mildly connected to the subject of Taguchi: When I was out taking my morning walk, I gave a bit of thought to the question of his contribution to Japanese manufacturing dominance, and remembered how in the late 50's, early 60's their "trannies" were a technological marvel, but their quality control was a real joke. Even as an apprentice in the early 70's our instructors would deride Japanese quality control. At the same time, off the shelf Japanese bikes were starting to seriously out perform their British rivals. The thing is, this type of high performance engine tuning requires superb mastery of quality control.

I used to work on ten parts per million.
And that was UK manufacturing.
I think the biggest takeaway was all nations were equal.
But the British like to berate themselves, the Japanese don't.
The funniest one was "Honda" cars made on the same line as BL badged cars attracted a substantial badge premium, it was an identical car.