Type 2 Diabetes, exercise and B12 depletion

[clivealive]

I was a brummy and we spoke a completely different language Matt

 

[clivealive]

.... sugar is just another carbohydrate - not a food group on its own - and it is (IM not very HO) utter madness specifying it separately as if it was.

Thyroid test is one of the annual blood tests you will now automatically have because you are diabetic - I'm very surprised it hasn't been done already. Why don't you change your doctor if he's unhelpful generally?

Hi again,
Here's my ignorance showing again - I thought we got sugar from the carbohydrate in food.
I can see a comment on my April blood test report which says "Notes: Not on thyroid therapy\fbg up" but that might as well be in Swahili for all that means to me - along with the rest of the results.

 

[clivealive]

High blood sugar can cause B12 leeching because it's water soluble (even when entering the blood directly), you have probably noticed that high blood sugar makes you thirsty, so you drink more and in turn flush more vitamin B12 out of your system. Prior to diagnosis I had a B12 level of 41 that refused to increase, turns out it was the combination of excess water consumption and a weird problem I knew about with intrinsic factor. Insulin treatment is also known to cause B12 problems but I don't know why, I just rock up for jabs and do as I'm told. Probably worth mentioning to the doc though because when I was in B12 hell I could tell my B12 levels were dropping about a week before the injection because I just wasn't building up any reserves. Hope you feel better soon 🙂

Thanks KookyCat,
Apart from the tiredness I don't seem to manifest the symptoms associated with diabetes with respect to thirst and needing to drink a lot. If anything I don't drink enough for a "normal" person and never have done and I'm only on Metformin - not insulin, but then what do I know - I'm just finding it so confusing. Maybe that's the P.A as well...

I can however identify with you on the "week before the injection" syndrome you mentioned and my next jab is on Monday - can't wait...

 

[trophywench]

I was a brummy and we spoke a completely different language Matt

ROFL - I'm most affronted if people accuse me of being a Brummie ! - and I bet any Brummies who hear the accusation are affronted too, probably wouldn't want to be associated with a Baggies resident, would they? But I have been known to consort with a Brummie - was married to one for nearly 30 years till he buggered off with a blonde. So I did too! LOL

What's 'USED to be a Brummie' sposed to mean anyway! - I haven't lived in West Brom for most of my life - most of it has been in Kidderminster and latterly, just outside Coventry - but hell - you can take me out of West Brom - but you can never take WB out of me! LOL

The notes tell me you don't take any thyroid medication LOL I should think you might have worked that one out? - but that leads me to suspect that maybe you DID have a Thyroid blood test and maybe it's a bit on the high side? However actually - after ONE high blood test they wouldn't normally give you anything, they'll usually just do another one in X amount of time and see what that says, cos it could just be a rogue result (these things happen) so unless it's like mega high or mega low with definite symptoms they'll just keep an eye on it from ONE such test.

FBG means 'Fasting Blood Glucose' so it was a blood test they did before you ate anything that day - and it was higher than an undiabetic person would normally get. (note the term 'undiabetic' - ie I didn't say 'normal' - because WE are 'normal' - THEY are all Muggles! LOL)

THEY would see something roughly between 4 -7, usually nearer 5, 5.5. Ish, or thereabouts.

All people (us and them) turn all carbohydrates we happen to eat whatever they are defined as - eg all sugar including fructose (in fruit, funnily enough) starches (grains, spuds and to a lesser extent all root veg, and type of flour, grains, rice ....... so includes breads, pasta .....) and even milk sugar even though there's not that much (lactose - so milk, butter, cream, yoghurt ...) into glucose, which it puts into our blood, which circulates round the body to fuel all the cells in out body. That's every single cell, wherever it happens to be. It gets into our cells with the help of the insulin we produce - or inject if we are type 1. Insulin is usually described as 'the key that opens the cell doors to let the glucose in'. In a Muggle, and spare glucose is negated by the pancreas producing a bit more insulin and getting rid of it so it doesn't harm us. In a diabetic there is either a lack of insulin, or the body has an associated condition called insulin resistance - so the body needs MORE insulin than a Muggle needs to do the same job. The pancreas has to 'run faster to stand still'.

Thing is if there's not enough insulin, or the mechanism is broken (insulin resistance) then the untreated glucose gets into bit of us that it shouldn't on the way out in our pee - which can soon damage the organs unless the problem (ie diabetes !) is treated.

Are you still with me? LOL Hope I've explained it well enough - hope so!

 

[clivealive]

Hi and thanks again trophywench,

I never really really was a Brummie. My mother was evacuated to Bidford on Avon for my birth in 1941 but I was "brung up in Brum" until I ran away from home after the stomach surgery at the age of 17 - so even "USED to be" is a misnomer - and I've never wanted to go back.

WOW!! - what an encyclopedic response - thank you. I think I understand what you are saying re carbohydrates and the dietitian I saw a month or so ago was "happy" with my food intake - which is somewhat restricted due to my tummy problems.

There was something rather odd about the blood test in April from which it was deduced that I was diabetic.
Firstly it was scheduled, not by my own GP, but by the senior partner who was retiring (whom I had never seen) and she was probably sifting through the records for something to do. Secondly on the day of the test I had arrived for my usual monthly B12 injection (for P.A.) to be told by the nurse "Oh - you're due for a blood test - I'll do it now shall I?". Thirdly - I hadn't fasted and the test was at 9.00am within an hour of my having eaten my normal breakfast.

The results of that test showed the HbA1c level 51 mmol/mol (20 - 42) and !Plasma fasting glucose level 7.4 mmol/L (3.0 - 6.0).
Notes: "Not on Thyroid therapy\fbg up"

Despite being an accountant for most of my working life these figures are meaningless and just gobbledygook to me, but I wonder whether my not fasting might have "corrupted" the results. I guess it's all a bit late in the day now.

My August HbA1c test came out at 40 mmol/mol (20 - 42) with no mention of fasting or Thyroid and my Metformin was cut from 4 to 2 a day

Perhaps I'm more of a muddle than a muggle?

 

[Northerner]

Hi Clive, an HbA1c of over 48 is considered to be in the diabetic range, so this is why you received your diagnosis. However, you have since improved to 40, which is nicely within the non-diabetic range, most likely due to the modifications you may have made to your diet and activity levels. The HbA1c would not be affected at all by the fact you hadn't fasted, however the the 'plasma fasting glucose level' would have been - anything over 7.0 for a 'true' FBG would also indicate diabetes, so for the doctors this would have been seen as confirmation.

You sound as though you are managing your diabetes well, so as the others have said, perhaps the tiredness is related to the B12 and not your blood glucose levels 🙂

 

[trophywench]

Yes - I agree with Alan on that.

The HBA1c test, tests how much Glucose has stuck to our red blood cells over the last 12-ish weeks - as the average lifespan of a red blood cell is apparently around that, so there'll be older ones and newer ones in there which gives a good cross section. However it is NOT a straight average - it's something over half during the last 4 weeks, then over half of the remainder over the previous 4 weeks, and the rest for the oldest 4 weeks, if you see what I mean. (something like 55%, 30%, 15% - ish !)

You should actually mention to your GP that the first one wasn't a fasting test, cos he'll likely be a bit surprised as to how you improved your 'fasting' test so quickly - since it seems to me that he actually does have a brain that he uses for thinking LOL (Not always in evidence, with a fair proportion of GPs - we know they were born with one, but sometimes they don't seem to use it .... ) But anyway - you are doing OK.

So carry on doing what you are doing, I'd say!