Thyroid problems causing diabetes

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melissaginty13

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Hi all when I was at my endo a few weeks ago the doctor told me that as well as radiotherapy causing my diabetes (unsure of type) that my thyroid issues (born without a thyroid) also would’ve likely caused me to have diabetes in the future . I’m just wondering what type would that likely be as I’ve been told I’m definitely not type 2 but haven’t tested positive yet for any type 1 antibodies
Thanks ☺️
 
A percentage of people with LADA/Type 1/1.5 test negative for the Type 1 antibodies @melissaginty13 so it might be that. I don’t know about the thyroid thing - sorry.
 
Inka said:
A percentage of people with LADA/Type 1/1.5 test negative for the Type 1 antibodies @melissaginty13 so it might be that. I don’t know about the thyroid thing - sorry.
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Thank you inka , I’ve heard this but my endo isn’t having any of it as your only type 1 when your positive for the antibodies in their eyes which is frustrating. I would love to find out my type as I want a pump to help me better manage but my endo won’t provide that for me as I haven’t tested positive for t1 so I’m trying to do my own research and meet new people with similar situation as myself
 
Inka said:
Just thought - have you had your C Peptide tested @melissaginty13 ?
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Yeah I have had that test and I still produce insulin I think it was 1000 mmol that i produce but after i eat anything my sugars go through the roof to like 18/19 mmol and im currently on insulin pens of long term and fast acting
 
melissaginty13 said:
Yeah I have had that test and I still produce insulin I think it was 1000 mmol that i produce but after i eat anything my sugars go through the roof to like 18/19 mmol and im currently on insulin pens of long term and fast acting
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So that sounds more like Type 2 then? Plenty of insulin but your body is resistant to it, hence the high sugars.

How much of each insulin type do you have to take?

Just found this brief article re thyroid and diabetes:

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/ar... that there is,development of type 2 diabetes.

.
 
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Inka said:
So that sounds more like Type 2 then? Plenty of insulin but your body is resistant to it, hence the high sugars.

How much of each insulin type do you have to take?

Just found this brief article re thyroid and diabetes:

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/thyroid-and-diabetes#:~:text=Evidence suggests that there is,development of type 2 diabetes.

.
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My endocrinologist said it’s not type 2 aswell so that’s why it confused me they said they call it secondary diabetes whatever that means . I take 9 units with corrections of novorapid but sometimes I can take almost 20 units and my sugars will still be above 15 . And I take 22 units of xultophy , thank you I will read that ☺️
 
I had to Google Xultophy. That’s a mix of insulin and another drug:

Xultophy® 100/3.6 is a combination drug consisting of liraglutide, a long-acting glucagon-like peptide-1 receptor agonist, and insulin degludec, a long-acting basal insulin.

Secondary to having no thyroid maybe? It sounds a bit like steroid-induced diabetes in a way as with that the steroids cause diabetes which is Type 2-like. So not having a thyroid might have a knock on effect - ie causing diabetes.
 
Inka said:
I had to Google Xultophy. That’s a mix of insulin and another drug:

Xultophy® 100/3.6 is a combination drug consisting of liraglutide, a long-acting glucagon-like peptide-1 receptor agonist, and insulin degludec, a long-acting basal insulin.

Secondary to having no thyroid maybe? It sounds a bit like steroid-induced diabetes in a way as with that the steroids cause diabetes which is Type 2-like. So not having a thyroid might have a knock on effect - ie causing diabetes.
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Yeah I’ve heard people having type 3c or lada also from steroids and people having the c peptide testing done and producing insulin but still having t1 , it’s all just so confusing and everyone is different and I’ve been told I’m an extremely rare case so that’s really just so frustrating for me especially since it hinders me from getting an insulin pump , thank you for your help I appreciate that alot ☺️
 
@melissaginty13 , when you had your radiotherapy, did you have any steroids at all, during your treatment? Steroids can have quite marked impacts on blood glucose.

Being born without a thyroid suggests your endocrine system may be a bit out of kilter. I assume you take some hormone replacement for your thyroid? Do you take Levothyroxine, or other meds in addition?
 
AndBreathe said:
@melissaginty13 , when you had your radiotherapy, did you have any steroids at all, during your treatment? Steroids can have quite marked impacts on blood glucose.

Being born without a thyroid suggests your endocrine system may be a bit out of kilter. I assume you take some hormone replacement for your thyroid? Do you take Levothyroxine, or other meds in addition?
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Hi yeah I was on steroids for a while as I had a bone marrow transplant so I had chemo aswell. And yeah I take Eltroxin as a hormone , that was the first time I was ever told that they are linked after 26 !
 
None of this sounds like type 1, as the c peptide was 1000 which is much higher than normal. Was that stimulated or unstimulated (was your bg high at the time of the test?), but doesn’t make any difference to conclusion as it’s high on both views.

The reason you take insulin and it doesn’t go down then is likely insulin resistance which is a feature of type 2. The other issues you have going on probably mean it’s a rarer form of type 2, or it’s a type 2 form with different causes to usual. This might mean that remission isn’t achievable for you.

But, the cause of your diabetes doesn’t look like type 1 as no antibodies and you produce shedloads of insulin. Type 1 is where an autoimmune attack stops your body producing insulin, you don’t have evidence of either of those things so I’d agree not type 1.

For reference my cpeptide was about 300 I think, stimulated, which is low but not low enough for the definite t1 range. My antibodies were positive but a weak positive. So I was diagnosed undetermined type as the results weren’t strong enough for conclusive type 1.
 
Lucyr said:
None of this sounds like type 1, as the c peptide was 1000 which is much higher than normal. Was that stimulated or unstimulated (was your bg high at the time of the test?), but doesn’t make any difference to conclusion as it’s high on both views.

The reason you take insulin and it doesn’t go down then is likely insulin resistance which is a feature of type 2. The other issues you have going on probably mean it’s a rarer form of type 2, or it’s a type 2 form with different causes to usual. This might mean that remission isn’t achievable for you.

But, the cause of your diabetes doesn’t look like type 1 as no antibodies and you produce shedloads of insulin. Type 1 is where an autoimmune attack stops your body producing insulin, you don’t have evidence of either of those things so I’d agree not type 1.

For reference my cpeptide was about 300 I think, stimulated, which is low but not low enough for the definite t1 range. My antibodies were positive but a weak positive. So I was diagnosed undetermined type as the results weren’t strong enough for conclusive type 1.
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Hi Lucy , yeah I see what your saying but my endo ruled out type 2 but said they can’t rule out t1 and new antibodies become available to test all the time , with mine stemming from cancer treatment and possibly down to not having thyroid it’s an unusual case apparently. I’ve also spoken to some type ones in a Facebook group and some have told me they have t1 still produce insulin but it doesn’t work so basically insulin resistance and then with other types like 1.5 or 3c aswell I’ve been told i possibly might have or I have even made a new type up altogether. Either way very frustrating , I don’t think I have the usual type 1 but I think mine is a mixture of both type 1&2 .
 
melissaginty13 said:
Hi Lucy , yeah I see what your saying but my endo ruled out type 2 but said they can’t rule out t1 and new antibodies become available to test all the time , with mine stemming from cancer treatment and possibly down to not having thyroid it’s an unusual case apparently. I’ve also spoken to some type ones in a Facebook group and some have told me they have t1 still produce insulin but it doesn’t work so basically insulin resistance and then with other types like 1.5 or 3c aswell I’ve been told i possibly might have or I have even made a new type up altogether. Either way very frustrating , I don’t think I have the usual type 1 but I think mine is a mixture of both type 1&2 .
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Did you have diabetes prior to your steroids/chemo/transplant?

In terms of your Eltroxin; has anyone ever to you to take it at least 45 minutes before you have anything to eat or drink? Some folks prefer to take it at night, just before going to bed, but that becomes personal choice.

If you are taking thyroid meds already, the TSH test is pretty useless because of how the meds work. The important tests will be the FT4, T3 and antibodies, although you may have had antibodies tested already.

You really do need your T3 tested, and NHS labs seem to make up their own minds whether they will run the test or not. If FT4 is in range, they tend not to bother, but if, like me, you are pretty rubbish at converting T4 to T3, it is critical. (I take T3 in addition to T4).

Thyroid disease is a funny old game in a not at all amusing way. 🙂
 
AndBreathe said:
Did you have diabetes prior to your steroids/chemo/transplant?

In terms of your Eltroxin; has anyone ever to you to take it at least 45 minutes before you have anything to eat or drink? Some folks prefer to take it at night, just before going to bed, but that becomes personal choice.

If you are taking thyroid meds already, the TSH test is pretty useless because of how the meds work. The important tests will be the FT4, T3 and antibodies, although you may have had antibodies tested already.

You really do need your T3 tested, and NHS labs seem to make up their own minds whether they will run the test or not. If FT4 is in range, they tend not to bother, but if, like me, you are pretty rubbish at converting T4 to T3, it is critical. (I take T3 in addition to T4).

Thyroid disease is a funny old game in a not at all amusing way. 🙂
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Not that I’m aware of cos I would’ve had loads of testing done prior to the transplant and then I was always having blood tests every 3 months since being born as being born without a thyroid . I take my Eltroxin in the morning everyday 30 minutes before food but as a child I took it before bed and if my memory corrects me it wasn’t working right . I have all my levels checked as I always need my dose adjusted as they told me when my weight fluctuates it needs to be adjusted as it affects my heart rate . Thyroid problems really are a funny thing and I think most of my problems stem from that, I would’ve been managed by my gp for my hypothyroidism only for being diagnosed with diabetes but in my opinion I should’ve been with an endocrinologist since birth for my thyroid issues
 
melissaginty13 said:
Hi Lucy , yeah I see what your saying but my endo ruled out type 2 but said they can’t rule out t1 and new antibodies become available to test all the time
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I don’t understand why he’d say he can’t rule out type 1 with your cpeptide being so high. Type 1 means your blood sugars are high because your body stops producing enough insulin. Your body is drowning in insulin but not using it properly. So it doesn’t sound at all like type 1.

Have you definitely remembered the cpeptide value correctly? Do you have the units in case it’s in some obscure atypical units?
 
Lucyr said:
I don’t understand why he’d say he can’t rule out type 1 with your cpeptide being so high. Type 1 means your blood sugars are high because your body stops producing enough insulin. Your body is drowning in insulin but not using it properly. So it doesn’t sound at all like type 1.

Have you definitely remembered the cpeptide value correctly? Do you have the units in case it’s in some obscure atypical units?
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Yeah I’ve seen on here people produce more insulin then me I can’t remember the girls name but her c pep tests were 1500 and she was diagnosed as type 1 but yeah it was definitely 1000mmol cos the nurse said I produce plenty they just aren’t sure why it doesn’t work so good . I had the test done when I was 15 (now 26 ) and the levels have more or less stayed the same , would it suggest that even tho I produce insulin that it basically doesn’t work anymore especially since the level stayed the same or would the level have got significantly lower if the at makes any sense
 
Lucyr said:
Cpeptide is usually measured in pmol, not mmol, so perhaps you’ve got the value or the units wrong.
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That’s a possibility as I can’t remember exactly what unit she used I just remember her saying it was 1000 sorry about that
 
melissaginty13 said:
That’s a possibility as I can’t remember exactly what unit she used I just remember her saying it was 1000 sorry about that
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I understand you’ve been diabetic for several years - about 9 years?

If you clarify the units and it is pmol then this is the table to help interpret it which says very unlikely type 1 with cpeptide that high after this many years. If the units were mmol you’d need to convert them though. You also need to check what your bg was at the time of the test for whether it was stimulated or unstimulated but it won’t impact the interpretation if you can get a cpeptide value in pmol.

Scroll down to general interpretation section

C-Peptide Exeter Clinical Laboratory International

www.exeterlaboratory.com www.exeterlaboratory.com
 
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