Statins

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s'nic said:
Many people take statins without issue, and you should make a personal choice whether statins will benefit you. However please check your results first as has been pointed out - 2.4 is low for total cholesterol.

My total cholesterol was 7.7 and I made the choice to try reducing it via diet - my doctor had no objections to that.
After I made that decision I read of potential risks like liver, diabetes and kidney problems. I'm glad I took the dietary choice as I already have kidney issues and am awaiting an ultrasound now to check my liver.
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What exactly did you change in your diet and how is your total, HDL and LDL now? Trying to figure that out myself after I locked the cheese away for months, only to find my total and LDL went up :(
 
I was only diagnosed at the end of january, so I will not know my new readings until the 6 monthly check.
From the reading I've done a few things stand out - cholesterol is needed, and our liver can produce approx. 80% of the cholesterol we need.
Secondly high cholesterol seems to be blamed on the total amount of saturated fats we eat, not specific items, so it's a case of swapping items out rather than excluding them.
Also organs like liver and kidneys work best when we are not overweight.

So bearing in mind this is only my personal research - the key thing seems to be keep saturated fats lower and lose weight to bring cholesterol under control. One interesting point I saw was that while losing weight/dieting and restricting fats, the body may produce extra triglycerides to compensate.
I have decided to slow down the weight loss and then stabilise my weight prior to my next blood tests - hopefully my body will quit the production of any extra triglycerides if I do that (I can hope anyhow).

I'm using the benecol type drinks daily (supermarket own brand are cheaper), and having oats as part of my breakfast. I'm also working on exercise as that is beneficial to cholesterol levels. Increasing fibre in the diet should help too.
3g of beta-glucan a day as part of a healthy diet and lifestyle can help to lower cholesterol (from my research) - that's 3 servings where 1 serving is 13g oatbran, or 30g oats, or 75g pearl barley, or 3 oatcakes. I'm having roughly half of that 3g - oats contain carbs, and I'm trying to lower those as well.

I've switched to fat free yogurt/milk at the moment purely to try sort out my diet to the point where I'm comfortable that all daily meals will not exceed my maximum saturated fats (based off approx calorie intake for a female of my age/activity).
So basically trying to cover all bases 😉
 
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Mumpie_olgran said:
Not strictly a diabetes question but grateful for any knowledge out there nonetheless

I've been in statins for the last few months after my cholesterol went a bit nuts (total number north of 10 somewhere and ratio of good to bad I can't remember exactly but the doc referred to it as "striking")

I haven't reacted too badly to the specific Statin (Atorvastatin 40mg) but I suspect it's been behind reduced sleep quality and funnily enough I wonder if it's slightly affecting my memory too. I'm having to really concentrate on remembering wider circle of friends' surnames and that kind of thing, which has always come really easily to me. Could just be aging process or jumping at shadows of course

To the point - has anyone else experienced similar and any view as to whether switching Statin to a different brew would help? Are they all basically the same but different branding or actual differences chemically?
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Jasmin2000 said:
What exactly did you change in your diet and how is your total, HDL and LDL now? Trying to figure that out myself after I locked the cheese away for months, only to find my total and LDL went up :(
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I am interested in the points raised about links between statins and type 2, my increase in blood sugar seems to have started when I began taking Atorvastatin 3 years ago. At that point my Hba1c was 37, a year later I was prediabetic (although I wasn't told this until 2 years later whwen it was 98) Not overweight then or now. On Mettformin since Nov 23, latest test down to 55.
No medical staff ever mentioned a possible connection. Not sure how to proceed now
 
Beancounter298 said:
I am interested in the points raised about links between statins and type 2, my increase in blood sugar seems to have started when I began taking Atorvastatin 3 years ago. At that point my Hba1c was 37, a year later I was prediabetic (although I wasn't told this until 2 years later whwen it was 98) Not overweight then or now. On Mettformin since Nov 23, latest test down to 55.
No medical staff ever mentioned a possible connection. Not sure how to proceed now
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Type 2 is diagnosed from BG after fasting and A1c - too high and it's a potential Type 2 diagnosis. In the Pfizer scandal - many patients (non-diabetics) given statins were diagnosed as type 2 when their BG rose.

Most Type 2's are diagnosed before statins anyways, but for some on statins BG will increase and I do wonder how many are diagnosed purely because of their statins (like the Pfizer patients). The clinical data for statins increasing BG is now overwhelming but there's no resolution on which people are affected.

I've demonstrated for myself that if I stop taking statins, my BG average drops 0.5 mmol/L. So I have the choice to mimic the statin effect through diet (hence my question) or accept the potential shorter lifespan with a higher A1c.

I'm not giving any medical advice here, but might be worth speaking with your GP and trying a 3-month break from statin to see what happens to average BG, A1c and lipid profiles.
 
Jasmin2000
An update on the other info regarding high cholesterol and diet
When reading up on weight loss I saw that very low fat diets are best done under supervision of a dietician (or similar). i also read that 25% fat in a diet was considered a very strict low fat diet. That lead me to search for information on the minimum fat required by the human body.

It turned out that actual hard data on minimum fats required by the human body each day is scarce. But I did find this info.
Approximate minimum intake (g/day)
7-12 Lessens gallstone formation
20-30 Supports essential fatty acid intake & fat-soluble vitamin absorption
40-60 Supports sex hormone levels
It came with a caveat: "These are approximate values based on surprisingly limited evidence. They are absolute minimums, not recommendations."
I got this info from this website, and I make no personal claims as to it's accuracy - https://www.strongerbyscience.com/dietary-fat

heartuk.org.uk quotes 70g total fat for a woman and 90g for a man with no other details.
My reading lead me to a figure of no more than 10% of your daily calories in maximum saturated fat
eg < total calories> x 10%, then divide that figure by 9 as there are 9 calories per gram of fat
so for 2000 calories it's 2000 x 10% = 200, then 200 divided by 9 = 22.22g maximum saturated fats per day in a 2000 calorie diet

Two sites with useful info
- https://www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/risk-factors/high-cholesterol
- https://www.heartuk.org.uk/low-cholesterol-foods/choose-low-cholesterol-foods

It seems a mediteranean type diet is useful. I made a considered choice to use zero fat milk/yogurt because I want to widen my choice of meal ingredients, include olive oil in my cooking AND not exceed my max saturated fats per day.

I misremembered when i said triglycerides were released when losing weight. This is the actual info I found:
"Weight loss can sometimes cause your LDL to go up temporarily. This can cause your total cholesterol value to go up. HDL tend to go down as the body releases fatty acids in your blood, this can happen with any weight loss regime and is the normal biochemical reaction during weight loss."
"If you’re in the process of losing weight and your blood cholesterol levels are going up in spite of your weight loss, don’t panic! It’s completely normal for blood cholesterol levels to go up temporarily as your body burns some of the stored fat it’s carrying for fuel. You won’t be able to get accurate blood cholesterol readings until your weight has stabilised for at least four weeks, and your blood cholesterol levels have had a chance to normalise."
 
Statins are a very hot and controversial topic. I was convinced by a TED talk by somebody who said it was high carb diet that was more likely to result in high cholesterol not fats in the diet.
I take 10mg statin which I was taking before diagnosis and have continued to take but despite having cheese, full fat yoghurt, butter, cream along with a low carb regime my cholesterol is 3.2, ratios very good and triglycerides half of the bottom of the range.
People need to do their own research and make up their own mind up, it is your choice.
 
Leadinglights said:
People need to do their own research and make up their own mind up, it is your choice.
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I totally agree, any information I provided here is not any recommendation, it is purely information. In my last post I mainly wanted to point out that it's not healthy to try exclude all fats.

I have to admit I am finding low carb options I want to eat to be difficult, so am just managing my diet as best I can at the moment. A part of the problem is tiring easily so I need to have items that are quick and easy to prep/cook.
 
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In the last 2 weeks memories have come back to me.
It is over 7 years since I stopped the Atorvastatin. It was 18 months before the last ache went away but memories have come in waves, usually something triggers a single recollection and then more associations come back over some weeks. I suppose I ought to be grateful that they have come back at all, but I find it hard to be charitable about statins.
My sister mourns for her husband. He's still alive, but since starting the statins he's no longer the man she married. He sits in front of the TV and can't remember the films he's seen. He used to like to read, now he can't follow the plot. They can't even have a conversation as he loses the thread. She's tried to get him to stop them, but because the GP prescribed them, he continues to take them.
 
s'nic said:
Jasmin2000
An update on the other info regarding high cholesterol and diet
When reading up on weight loss I saw that very low fat diets are best done under supervision of a dietician (or similar). i also read that 25% fat in a diet was considered a very strict low fat diet. That lead me to search for information on the minimum fat required by the human body.

It turned out that actual hard data on minimum fats required by the human body each day is scarce. But I did find this info.
Approximate minimum intake (g/day)
7-12 Lessens gallstone formation
20-30 Supports essential fatty acid intake & fat-soluble vitamin absorption
40-60 Supports sex hormone levels
It came with a caveat: "These are approximate values based on surprisingly limited evidence. They are absolute minimums, not recommendations."
I got this info from this website, and I make no personal claims as to it's accuracy - https://www.strongerbyscience.com/dietary-fat

heartuk.org.uk quotes 70g total fat for a woman and 90g for a man with no other details.
My reading lead me to a figure of no more than 10% of your daily calories in maximum saturated fat
eg < total calories> x 10%, then divide that figure by 9 as there are 9 calories per gram of fat
so for 2000 calories it's 2000 x 10% = 200, then 200 divided by 9 = 22.22g maximum saturated fats per day in a 2000 calorie diet

Two sites with useful info
- https://www.bhf.org.uk/informationsupport/risk-factors/high-cholesterol
- https://www.heartuk.org.uk/low-cholesterol-foods/choose-low-cholesterol-foods

It seems a mediteranean type diet is useful. I made a considered choice to use zero fat milk/yogurt because I want to widen my choice of meal ingredients, include olive oil in my cooking AND not exceed my max saturated fats per day.

I misremembered when i said triglycerides were released when losing weight. This is the actual info I found:
"Weight loss can sometimes cause your LDL to go up temporarily. This can cause your total cholesterol value to go up. HDL tend to go down as the body releases fatty acids in your blood, this can happen with any weight loss regime and is the normal biochemical reaction during weight loss."
"If you’re in the process of losing weight and your blood cholesterol levels are going up in spite of your weight loss, don’t panic! It’s completely normal for blood cholesterol levels to go up temporarily as your body burns some of the stored fat it’s carrying for fuel. You won’t be able to get accurate blood cholesterol readings until your weight has stabilised for at least four weeks, and your blood cholesterol levels have had a chance to normalise."
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Thanks for these refs. I'm low carb (30g), lowish fat too (nowhere near 70g) and burn about 2000 kcal/day in th gym. Most of my diet is green and protein, hence the weird high cholesterol/LDL results.

The triglyceride hint is interesting, I don't think I'm losing weight - at least that's not the plan - and my blood triglycerides are normal. All of this says it's probably my own liver cholesterol synthesis that is very active and this speaks for statins unfortunately.
 
s'nic said:
I totally agree, any information I provided here is not any recommendation, it is purely information. In my last post I mainly wanted to point out that it's not healthy to try exclude all fats.

I have to admit I am finding low carb options I want to eat to be difficult, so am just managing my diet as best I can at the moment. A part of the problem is tiring easily so I need to have items that are quick and easy to prep/cook.
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It is hard to make suggestions to people when everybody's tastes are different but things like cooked meats, cheeses, salads, coleslaw, eggs are all easy if you have them in your fridge. I find the Lightly dusted fish fillets are low carb and cook easily either in the oven or airfryer.
High meat content sausages are low carb, many are only 2g carb or less per sausage.
 
I was put on statins (Atorvastatin) a few weeks ago, my BG started to go up and stay up. I had been about 80% TIR and it dropped to around 46%.
By the time I had done 5 weeks on them I decided that enough was enough and I would stop them, discussed this with the GP who agreed that this could be the reason and said we would see what happens.
That was 2 weeks ago my BG is now around 73%.
I have blood tests next week for cholesterol and HbA1c so it will be interesting to see what they show.
 
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