Ready made packet grains

[nonethewiser]

Even if not low-carb or needing to count carbs for insulin all people with diabetes or at risk need to be aware of the carbs they eat, and that as far as their diabetes goes, the carbs are the crucial factor, not fat or salt, which is why traffic lights are unhelpful. They perpetuate the myth that diabetes is all about sugar, not carbs.

Beg to differ, when told she was prediabetic my wife cut back on fat consumption to lose weight & also remove visceral fat around organs, so she bought low fat versions of diary products & removed fat off meats.

It worked as she lost 5 stone in total & all blood work since have been normal, that was 6 years ago now.

I could have told her about low carb approach but she already knew about it as once tried it myself, she didn't want to manage the condition but reverse it so she could eat a fairly normal diet, so far she has achieved that but is careful not to put weight back on.

So to say it's all about carbs & not other factors is stretching the truth, there's many approaches to manage diabetes they just don't get mentioned much on here which is a shame IMHO.

 

[Inka]

Well said @nonethewiser ! There are various diets that can work and ones including carbs can work too. I keep linking to Forks Over Knives but that because they have good testimonials, but they have plenty of people who’ve reversed Type 2 and lost weight by eating carbs, eg

How I Lost 140 Pounds, Cured My Type 2 Diabetes, and Saved Thousands in Medications

An inspirational story of how Eric O'Grey lost 140 pounds, cured his type 2 diabetes, and reclaimed his life with a plant-based diet.

www.forksoverknives.com

Their theory is that it’s excess fat, particularly animal fat, that causes insulin resistance.

 

[Eddy Edson]

Well said @nonethewiser ! There are various diets that can work and ones including carbs can work too. I keep linking to Forks Over Knives but that because they have good testimonials, but they have plenty of people who’ve reversed Type 2 and lost weight by eating carbs, eg

How I Lost 140 Pounds, Cured My Type 2 Diabetes, and Saved Thousands in Medications

An inspirational story of how Eric O'Grey lost 140 pounds, cured his type 2 diabetes, and reclaimed his life with a plant-based diet.

www.forksoverknives.com

Their theory is that it’s excess fat, particularly animal fat, that causes insulin resistance.

A big, very sophisticated study just published in Nature giving maybe the most robust evidence to dat4 for an association between saturated fat intake and not just CVD risk, but also T2D risk: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-024-03124-1

In conclusion, we selected lipid metabolites that are affected by replacing dietary SFAs [saturated fats] with plant-based UFAs [unsaturatd fats] in RCTs and showed that scores derived from these lipids are associated with self-reported dietary fat sources, dietary fatty acid composition and health-related dietary pattern adherence in free-living individuals. Lipidomics scores that reflect lower SFA intake and high plant-based UFA intake were consistently associated with reduced incidence of T2D and CVD in prospective cohort studies. The associations of lipidomics scores with diet and disease risk are stronger than established surrogate markers, yielding larger estimated cardiometabolic benefits of improved dietary fat quality. Our findings corroborate the cardiometabolic benefits of replacing dietary SFAs with plant-based UFAs by integrating data from RCTs and nutritional cohorts and suggest that lipidomics-based scores may provide sensitive metrics for the health-related metabolic adaptation to change in dietary fat quality.

DUK is to be comended for promoting evidence-based recommendations even when they go against messageboard anecdotes and dietary woo.

 

[Proud to be erratic]

@Anna DUK also suggested correctly, above, that wholegrains were more suitable than refined carbs for people who aren’t managing their diabetes by low carb, and they certainly tend to be healthier in general with vitamins etc in the bit that’s removed in processing, but the traffic light system tells you nothing about that at all!

Having belatedly picked up on this discussion, it seems to me that DUK need to step up and be a lot clearer that carbs need to be considered first and foremost. It feels generous of you @Robin to remark on the correct bit of what @Anna DUK originally said. However I can't help feeling that @rebrascora was spot on in pointing out that DUK drawing out the need to be aware of salt, fats and sugar without even mentioning carbs is very revealing. I understand DUK is walking a bit of a tightrope in trying to be if not fully supportive of poor NHS guidance at least not openly critical ... but that should not mean that a DUK online community team leader should omit even mentioning carbs in a response to a question about "Ready made packet grains".

I find myself increasingly feeling that the world has gone mad in so many ways. But that doesn't vindicate DUK from joining in the mayhem. We know from so many newcomers to this forum that the paucity of clear helpful guidance to patients from GPs and the NHS overall, after receiving the difficult news about a diagnosis of Diabetes, is a huge problem. That problem is not helped one iota by DUK not clearly and simply explaining that carbs are at the centre of managing Diabetes; and then if it is felt necessary getting into the minutiae of healthy eating, informing, confusing and worrying newcomers about fats, salt and sugars (along with ready made ultra-processed foods?).

Apologies @Anna DUK; I'm not looking to have an intense argument with anyone, least of all yourself from DUK. But I was stunned by your post at #2 in this thread and hugely relieved by post #3.

 

[Martin.A]

To be fair to @Anna DUK what she said, in response to a posting by someone 'at risk', is in line with what it says on the site about wholegrains, fats, sugars and salt:-

10 tips for healthy eating if you are at risk of type 2 diabetes

Lots of factors can contribute to someone being at risk of or diagnosed with type 2 diabetes.

www.diabetes.org.uk

One thing that often puzzles me, after 5 years on the site, is that some seem to rarely venture beyond the Forum when there's so much information on the site, instead sticking with what @Eddy Edson has called "messageboard anecdotes and dietary woo" (sic). Nothing wrong with that - their choice - but it seems a shame not to also tap in to the extensive library of information that is DUK.

 

[JITR]

We know from so many newcomers to this forum that the paucity of clear helpful guidance to patients from GPs and the NHS overall, after receiving the difficult news about a diagnosis of Diabetes, is a huge problem.

100% agree. Clear helpful (up to date) guidance from the NHS to GPs and patients alike would be a huge step forward.

The expensive Pathway to Remission programme will help 20,000 a year, but what about the other 130,000 a year also diagnosed every year who are left to fend for themselves? And the prediabetics and the undiagnosed?

Get David Unwin, Freshwell, Roy Taylor, Mike Lean, Nichola Guess and others round a table with a good publisher. The European Diabetes guidelines on diet classify the confidence level of each recommendation based on available evidence and so could this. No need to wait for years for incontrovertible results from large studies. Example, effectiveness of long term weight maintenance after remission.

David Unwin's diet sheet would be as good starting point as any:
- https://phcuk.org/wp-content/uploads/A_5_page_low_carb_diet_leaflet_Unwin_2021-converted.pdf

 

[Anna DUK]

Apologies @Anna DUK; I'm not looking to have an intense argument with anyone, least of all yourself from DUK. But I was stunned by your post at #2 in this thread and hugely relieved by post #3.

A healthy debate amongst us is important; it helps us to keep learning from each other. There are so many different ways people manage diabetes, whether at risk, newly diagnosed, or having lived with it for a while. Thank you for sharing your opinions everyone. I hope we haven't scared @Charslie away... ❤️