Ministers urged not to ‘threaten’ NHS staff over mandatory Covid jab (England)

[Eddy Edson]

In this case it's the same group (which is how this came up).

Though arguably they're not (I think) arguing that people shouldn't take any of the vaccines, they're merely searching the yellow card reporting system and reporting the nastiest sounding results and saying that they should be investigated. So (like the apparently crazy Naomi Wolf) they're just asking questions.

"Just asking questions" is the anti-vaxxer hallmark.

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

In this case it's the same group (which is how this came up).

Though arguably they're not (I think) arguing that people shouldn't take any of the vaccines, they're merely searching the yellow card reporting system and reporting the nastiest sounding results and saying that they should be investigated. So (like the apparently crazy Naomi Wolf) they're just asking questions.

Yes it was interesting that the report highlighting possible concerns over the vaccine was published by an organisation actively promoting an alternative. Rather coloured my view of the motivations behind the yellow card questions I’m afraid.

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

I’m not sure I can answer that, but Dr Tess Lawrie who signed the report you linked to seems to be quite central to BIRD (British Ivermectin Development Group)

”The BIRD meeting was convened by Dr. Tess Lawrie in order to present the findings from her rapid systematic review and meta-analysis of studies on the use of ivermectin to prevent and treat COVID-19.”

And I suppose it felt like such a group may have something of an agenda, and if they can present Ivermectin as an alternative against Covid19, may further their cause with vaccine hesitancy?

Perhaps I am being too cynical?

 

[Bruce Stephens]

And I suppose it felt like such a group may have something of an agenda, and if they can present Ivermectin as an alternative against Covid19, may further their cause with vaccine hesitancy?

Presumably, but @Amity Island is right that that doesn't suggest a financial motive (or not much of one, anyway).

On the other hand, I seem to remember reading there is quite a bit of money funding some of the anti vaccination stuff and maybe this is close enough that they get some of that. (I've no idea why anyone would fund such stuff but there's enough rich people that some of them are a bit strange.)

 

[mikeyB]

That trial has not been peer reviewed, nor has it been published in any reputable journal.

This whole Invermectin thing has sprung from it being effective in vitro against Covid. These tests, if used in humans, would likely cause severe health problems because the doses needed to affect the virus were nine times higher than the safe oral dose. In other words, it was less effective than Domestos, which works brilliantly, but you wouldn’t drink it.

Nonetheless, this info was picked up and rapidly gained traction. The FDA has forbidden its use in Covid infection, the BMJ has criticised all recent reports of the efficacy of Invermectin, and our government, on the advice of all scientists and virologists, have quite rightly ignored positive reports. Not one of them has been peer reviewed either in methodology or results. Not a single doctor in the UK would prescribe it off licence for treating, or preventing Covid infection because of the evidence from around the world.

One woman bleating on about trials which should be set up to assess its preventive ability against Covid is living in a fantasy world. They will never happen, despite her and the gullible Dr John Campbell that might be unethical to withhold this treatment because of its safety and “efficacy” is not only ludicrous, it’s almost criminally untrue, and will convince only the scientifically ignorant, and those unaware of the views of reputable virologists around the world. And yes, I mean you @Amity Island.

 

[BlueArmy]

Seems timely that this posted on BBC news website this morning. Looks like Oxford University are starting a trail on it's use.

Covid: Ivermectin to be studied as possible treatment in UK

Scientists begin to give the drug to people at home with symptoms to see if it can keep them out of hospital.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[mikeyB]

It’s the wrong headline for that story. It’s a useless study anyway, because the folk studied are self selecting, so have an inbuilt interest in getting better. Unless you have a strict double blind system, it will be worthless.

The story is wrong in one respect - it is not in formal use in the US, or indeed anywhere, and it’s wrong to compare the example of oral or inhaled steroids - they aren’t being used off licence.

 

[Bruce Stephens]

It’s a useless study anyway, because the folk studied are self selecting, so have an inbuilt interest in getting better. Unless you have a strict double blind system, it will be worthless.

The trial is randomised (so once you sign up it's random whether you get normal care or normal care with one of these trial drugs). I agree it's not blinded (so certainly not ideal). I wonder why they didn't try to blind it too?

 

[BlueArmy]

here it is then

Covid vaccine to be required for England care home staff https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57492264

were they listening to what I said, spooky.

“Care staff are expected to be given 16 weeks to have the jab - or face being redeployed away from frontline care, or lose their jobs”

although lose their job is a bit much

Covid: Unvaccinated frontline NHS staff at Southampton hospital to be redeployed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-58408971

Common sense prevails as unvaccinated staff are redeployed from front line care roles.