METFORMIN

[Drummer]

When I was prescribed Metformin there were instructions to increase the dose at intervals - 'as tolerated' - but I was so ill.
I tried it early and late, with food, before food after food - and the Atorvastatin prescribed with it didn't help either.
I could not leave the house after I had taken it - and if I took it later I needed to put towels round me in bed - what I really needed was nappies.
After about 5 weeks of total misery I gave up both the tablets and there was no alteration in my readings.
I think that just made it worse.
If I could have seem some reason for suffering the consequences of taking the tablets it might have helped to justify it, but by February I wasn't even in the diabetic range.

 

[the blue wildebeest]

When I was prescribed Metformin there were instructions to increase the dose at intervals - 'as tolerated' - but I was so ill.
I tried it early and late, with food, before food after food - and the Atorvastatin prescribed with it didn't help either.
I could not leave the house after I had taken it - and if I took it later I needed to put towels round me in bed - what I really needed was nappies.
After about 5 weeks of total misery I gave up both the tablets and there was no alteration in my readings.
I think that just made it worse.
If I could have seem some reason for suffering the consequences of taking the tablets it might have helped to justify it, but by February I wasn't even in the diabetic range.

Five weeks is a very long time to experience such effects. I thought my experience was typical: three days of abdominal pains, eventually diminishing, and repeated for the same time after the increase, but I now wonder if a more rigorous and informed dietary management might have made the Metformin unnecessary.
Congratulations on your HbA1c.

 

[Annette&Bert]

r
Annette I would not increase my medication without discussing it with my GP first...you say your BG levels are 'much better'...just wondering why then you felt the need to increase the Metformin...presumably you are adjusting your diet & activity levels (if you are able to exercise)...so if you are also testing...then you should be able to see those BG levels reduce...if you simply increase the medication in order to lower them...how will you know whether you are managing your diabetes as well as you can...this is not a criticism...just concerned you would increase your meds in those circumstances...metformin is used in conjunction with your own efforts to reduce your levels...it won't do it 'all' for you...if you are having your regular eye screening...then if there were any eye problems...this should pick that up...I have no idea why your nurse would say 'type 2 drugs are added...not subtracted'...I disagree with that...I started off with 500mgs of Metformin twice daily in July last year...my BG was 17.4 at diagnosis...now with an average of 5.8 I only take 500mgs once daily...it is possible to reduce the medication providing you are able to manage your diabetes effectively...why not discuss this with your GP before you continue...the temptation is too take more...however...that may lead to you relying heavily on that to manage your condition...and the need to increase your dose even more.

I don't actually think that my BG levels are controlled. I try very hard, and yes I do have regular screening, in fact long before I became diabetic, I was already attending the eye clinic since 2000 and told I'd be attending for the rest of my life due to the eye conditions I have, but I don't now want to be worried about developing diabetes eye problems, as I fear eventually that may lead to me not being able to drive - a fate worse than death. Whilst waiting for my cataract removal last year in my 'good' eye I couldn't drive for five months it was hellish, so I don't ever want that to happen again. I never know how to answer when someone says 'is your diabetes controlled?' Would someone tell me, how do I know this. If I take a reading first thing in the morning, and several readings throughout the day what should they read - no-one has ever explained this to me, and I'm no dummy - as far as my GP practice is concerned, sorry they're a waste of space and I'm not alone in my thoughts, I may change to another practice. I've had no diabetes check since Feb 2016

 

[grovesy]

Suggested targets are: before meals 4-7 mmols
2 hours after meals- 8.5 mmols.

 

[Bryan Osborne]

Yes keep and eye on the prescriptions, you should receive a repeat prescription leaflet in your pack of meds but most practices look at three to four days to turn the prescription round. I ended up going into a walk in surgery and telling them I was out of meds and would like a 28 tablet pack to allow me to keep on my regime. The doctor obliged and I have a bit of a buffer stock!

 

[Annette&Bert]

I never run out so far, as I take meds for another condition which means I really can't allow myself to run out. I once tried to order more than normal (I order online to my surgery) and low and behold I got a call from the surgery and they said that the doctor said I shouldn't need that many as I shouldn't be almost out. Well of course I wasn't I wanted a wee stock pile just in case haha.
As for my readings they are seldom lower than 7 and often much higher, but I'll take that on board and try to do things differently in future.

 

[trophywench]

Annette - have you tried reducing carbs when your BG increases too much after meals?

You do need to go back to the doc to get your script changed officially - because the 28 day supply won't last 28 days if you're taking more every day! Don't worry shedloads about the 1500mg in the meantime though, because the max dose of Met is 2000mg a day. But it does take up to 3 weeks to actually get the full effect of increased doses of Met - so you won't see if it helps for a while. Instant, it isn't - and it only helps your body do what it needs to, the Met doesn't deal with the carbs directly.

 

[Annette&Bert]

Hi Jenny, I tend mostly to eat complex carbs, but I do deviate when I get the 'fed up' feelings I'm afraid, and convince myself there's nothing wrong with me, having said that I don't tend to eat rubbish and the only meat I eat (since I was about 6 years old) is chicken and fish, so I get my carbs from multigrains, brown rice, brown pasta, but since I dislike it so much, I often sneak some macaroni cheese which I love haha. I'm not being flippant, but I do find it difficult sometimes to know how often I should eat. To explain further, I've never been someone who had a breakfast or in fact even a lunch, I never gave it much thought and ate when I needed to. Suddenly I find I'm diabetic and the nurse said I should always have a breakfast, lunch and dinner - well to be honest I blame my weight gain on the fact. So I'm more bothered about my weight at the minute. I am the type of person who doesn't like things to rule my life, but from what I've read on here, maybe I should let the diabetes rule it.

All I can tell you with a degree of certainty is that I'm so down and depressed and don't want to be diabetic - for me, it was the worst diagnosis I could have had.

 

[Drummer]

Hi Jenny, I tend mostly to eat complex carbs, but I do deviate when I get the 'fed up' feelings I'm afraid, and convince myself there's nothing wrong with me, having said that I don't tend to eat rubbish and the only meat I eat (since I was about 6 years old) is chicken and fish, so I get my carbs from multigrains, brown rice, brown pasta, but since I dislike it so much, I often sneak some macaroni cheese which I love haha. I'm not being flippant, but I do find it difficult sometimes to know how often I should eat. To explain further, I've never been someone who had a breakfast or in fact even a lunch, I never gave it much thought and ate when I needed to. Suddenly I find I'm diabetic and the nurse said I should always have a breakfast, lunch and dinner - well to be honest I blame my weight gain on the fact. So I'm more bothered about my weight at the minute. I am the type of person who doesn't like things to rule my life, but from what I've read on here, maybe I should let the diabetes rule it.

All I can tell you with a degree of certainty is that I'm so down and depressed and don't want to be diabetic - for me, it was the worst diagnosis I could have had.

Ah - well there is the problem - carbs are carbs - complex or not, wholemeal brown or whatever - you are putting up your levels by eating high carb foods.
As you have a meter, check before and two hours after starting to eat, and it your BG level is more than 2 whole numbers higher, you have eaten more carbs than you can cope with. Next time you have the same meal either remove the denst carb foods or cut down on the amount of it.

 

[Annette&Bert]

I feel that a lot of things were never fully explained to me, and although I know we need carbs, and most of us love them, it seems that if we don't eat any we might be fine, but we have to because we need to haha. I have 2 concerns, I want to lose weight I've put on since becoming typ2 and I want above all other considerations to protect my eyesight, that's my 2 dilemmas. Thanks for the info, I've learned more here than ever at my GP practice.

Now, having said all of that I am aware there are low carb diets which might be best suited for me. I am wondering (sorry if this sounds too logical) if carbs are out problem, why do we eat them if diabetic - surely the best thing is to eat none? I know we as humans are told we need carbs, diabetic or not, why do we need them?

 

[grovesy]

You have to find a way of eating that works for you and you can maintain long term. We all seem to have differnt tolerances. Not all of us cope on the same amount of carbohydrates. Many eat very few some of us eat more moderate amounts. I have found it is not always what carbohydrates we eat it sometimes more the amount or portion size. It is case of experiment with what you eat.

 

[Annette&Bert]

Thanks Grovesy, helpful as always. One of the things we all love of course is food, so it's hard at times. I know with me I tend to turn to food when things get me down - there's nothing about my life that should get me down, but sometimes I get the munchies which isn't helping either. I think I have low carb stuff in the house and in the fridge, and I think I'm doing fine then I take my BG and after doing well I'm astounded that some days it's in double figures - this worries me, I can't seem to find the right way, apart from the occasional treat or munchies, which are not things I'm doing on a daily basis, so I'm confused. I drink a lot of black coffee, have done for years, and I discovered that coffee puts it up - amazing, it's the caffeine of course.

 

[Drummer]

I feel that a lot of things were never fully explained to me, and although I know we need carbs, and most of us love them, it seems that if we don't eat any we might be fine, but we have to because we need to haha. I have 2 concerns, I want to lose weight I've put on since becoming typ2 and I want above all other considerations to protect my eyesight, that's my 2 dilemmas. Thanks for the info, I've learned more here than ever at my GP practice.

Now, having said all of that I am aware there are low carb diets which might be best suited for me. I am wondering (sorry if this sounds too logical) if carbs are out problem, why do we eat them if diabetic - surely the best thing is to eat none? I know we as humans are told we need carbs, diabetic or not, why do we need them?

The short answer is - we don't.
There are no essential carbs, and some peoples who lived where carbs were unavailable did very well without them.
I eat twice a day, low carb foods with protein and fats, and I seem to be doing brilliantly.
I gave myself a year to get down to a Hba1c in the 50s, as it seemed that was a good achievement - totally smashed that target and not even trying, just ignoring all the bad advice.

 

[Grannylorraine]

You have to find a way of eating that works for you and you can maintain long term. We all seem to have differnt tolerances. Not all of us cope on the same amount of carbohydrates. Many eat very few some of us eat more moderate amounts. I have found it is not always what carbohydrates we eat it sometimes more the amount or portion size. It is case of experiment with what you eat.

I agree with this, I can tolerate small amounts of potato, rice, couscous with very little rise, a small amount of pasta does cause a small spike of about 3, for me bread is a complete no-no, and when I say small amounts I am talking about a small jacket potato, for couscous, rice and pasta, I have the amount that fits into the palm of my hand. I also only have complex carbs at one meal per day. I did try cutting them out completely, but I was hungry and miserable all the time, and my levels are fairing a bit better since I changed back to eating small amounts of these last week.

 

[Annette&Bert]

thanks for the replies, I think I have to have a serious talk to myself about what I'm doing, my bg is always in double figures in the mornings which I don't understand that's even before I have my customary black coffee, I concluded that caffeine puts up the readings, so I take my bg before I have one - on the mornings I can be bothered. I don't know if it is diabetic related or not, but no matter how much sleep I get when I wake in the morning I'm so tired, sit on the sofa to watch news and black coffee, and before I know it I've fallen asleep for another 2 hours - amazes me. Drummer I don't eat twice a day - wish I did, I eat 4 times a day and fruit which I've always had as part of my life, if anyone ever told me not to eat fruit and veg I think I'd die.

 

[Derek Stubbs]

I find mornings worse for me aswell, it's the long period of inactivity from the previous evening that probably pushes the readings up.
I feel a bit better the longer the day goes on. If I go for a 15 minute jog, my levels come right down. I think my body is just a fuel machine
that needs to burn it off asap, but then needs replacing asap.

 

[grovesy]

I agree with this, I can tolerate small amounts of potato, rice, couscous with very little rise, a small amount of pasta does cause a small spike of about 3, for me bread is a complete no-no, and when I say small amounts I am talking about a small jacket potato, for couscous, rice and pasta, I have the amount that fits into the palm of my hand. I also only have complex carbs at one meal per day. I did try cutting them out completely, but I was hungry and miserable all the time, and my levels are fairing a bit better since I changed back to eating small

thanks for the replies, I think I have to have a serious talk to myself about what I'm doing, my bg is always in double figures in the mornings which I don't understand that's even before I have my customary black coffee, I concluded that caffeine puts up the readings, so I take my bg before I have one - on the mornings I can be bothered. I don't know if it is diabetic related or not, but no matter how much sleep I get when I wake in the morning I'm so tired, sit on the sofa to watch news and black coffee, and before I know it I've fallen asleep for another 2 hours - amazes me. Drummer I don't eat twice a day - wish I did, I eat 4 times a day and fruit which I've always had as part of my life, if anyone ever told me not to eat fruit and veg I think I'd die.

amounts of these last week.[/QUOT
It could be the Dawn Phenomon if you do a forum search it has been discussed lots.

 

[Stitch147]

One of the first things I was advised to do by the nurse when diagnosed was to reduce the amount of fruit that I was eating and to cut out certain fruits all together. I used to eat 6-7 portion of fruit a day. I now eat 1-2 and I know some fruits are completely off the menu, including grapes and pineapple (which used to be my favourite).

 

[Annette&Bert]

I never eat grapes or pineapple - they are my least favourites. I eat, blackberries, blueberries, strawberries and raspberries in the main, occasionally an apple or satsuma, water melon and melon, as well as mango - that's been my like for most of my life. Although all fruit contain fructose, but grapes have always been a no-no for me. One of my big problems is that I can't exercise other than normal day to day housework etc. I have pains in my back, hips and muscle pain in my legs, told the doctor about it several times. In the past five years, I have gone from someone walking with my wee dog for literally miles, to not being able to take the dog a walk at all, unless I know there's somewhere I can stop for a seat. I find it very frustrating and it seriously gets me down. I think I'm just at an age where my weight over the years has caught up with my body. I hate to see young girls grossly overweight, a thing we never used to see in this country, and they don't know what lies ahead of them. I'm over weight, but not grossly overweight, I'm struggling to lose it and I want to lose it desperately. Sorry if this bores anyone, but I do envy people who were born without ever having to worry about weight.

 

[Grannylorraine]

On my Diabetes information day, the dietitian said to eat not more than 3 portions of fruit a day, she said grapes, pineapple and banana were ok to eat occasionally but not everyday and for banana's she said either a very small one or 1/2 was the portion size for a diabetic, and then do not eat them once they start to get black flecks and ripen only when they were really yellow.