Long time listener; First time caller.

[Lucyr]

And I'm not sure many here will support my intended approach.

If it’s unconventional I probably would support trying it. Low carb isn’t for everyone, isn’t for me, and always annoys me how hard people push it when it says right at the top of the forum that everyone manages their health differently.

 

[JITR]

If it’s unconventional I probably would support trying it. Low carb isn’t for everyone, isn’t for me, and always annoys me how hard people push it when it says right at the top of the forum that everyone manages their health differently.

Nichola Guess, who is running the NewDawn project, reckons the active ingredient in 'low carb' is actually high protein.

 

[JITR]

Nichola Guess, who is running the NewDawn project, reckons the active ingredient in 'low carb' is actually high protein.

In other words, it may not matter so much whether you get the energy you need from 'healthy fats' and/or 'healthy carbs'. Provided you stay within limits, get all the nutrients you need, and give yourself time to digest.

Dr Guess says the amino acids from protein have independent pathways to the pancreas to stimulate the secretion of insulin. Independent from sugar and carbs. So T2Ds need more protein, eaten with every meal.

 

[beating_my_betes]

If it’s unconventional I probably would support trying it. Low carb isn’t for everyone, isn’t for me, and always annoys me how hard people push it when it says right at the top of the forum that everyone manages their health differently.

Thanks!

It's only unconventional from the perspective of the treatment du jour.

I'm trying to follow a high-carb, low-fat, plant-based plan. I have failed an embarrassing amount of times, but I feel confident this time.

The plan is pretty loose, as I don't do overly well with heavy restrictions, at least not for too long at a time. But it's really a combination of a lot of plant-based plans, with a nod to 'Eatwell', the govt. guidelines and the ADA guidelines.

 

[JITR]

Thanks!

It's only unconventional from the perspective of the treatment du jour.

I'm trying to follow a high-carb, low-fat, plant-based plan. I have failed an embarrassing amount of times, but I feel confident this time.

The plan is pretty loose, as I don't do overly well with heavy restrictions, at least not for too long at a time. But it's really a combination of a lot of plant-based plans, with a nod to 'Eatwell', the govt. guidelines and the ADA guidelines.

Yes, but what about protein a la Dr Guess (@11:25)?

 

[beating_my_betes]

Yes, but what about protein a la Dr Guess (@11:25)?

Nicola and Gil are both great people to name-check, but I'm not sure what you're asking me.

 

[JITR]

Nicola and Gil are both great people to name-check, but I'm not sure what you're asking me.

You say you are following a low fat, high carb, plant based, diet but do not mention protein. Dr Guess is programme manager for the NewDawn project which Diabetes UK are cofunding. The aim is to come up with alternatives to the NHS Soups And Shakes by 2027. She should be a leading authority on T2 diets by now so her views are of interest. In the link in my post she says protein is key. My question is how does protein figure in your diet?

 

[beating_my_betes]

You say you are following a low fat, high carb, plant based, diet but do not mention protein. Dr Guess is programme manager for the NewDawn project which Diabetes UK are cofunding. The aim is to come up with alternatives to the NHS Soups And Shakes by 2027. She should be a leading authority on T2 diets by now so her views are of interest. In the link in my post she says protein is key. My question is how does protein figure in your diet?

Ok, gotcha!

From what I can gather (Was listening while doing other things) there is no firm position on protein being 'key'. I'm also not sure about this idea that most people doing keto are getting success because it is also high-protein. Perhaps i've misunderstood or just didn't hear. However, it seems that most T2D on keto are prioritising fat. In fact, a recent move by a 'key player' in the keto movement, towards a higher protein (For satiety's sake), lower-fat & lower-carb approach, is causing huge ructions amogst the low-carb diabetic community.

As for me and my own plans? For the moment I'm avoiding all overt protein (Nicola refers to them as 'primary') and pretty much all overt fat. Im focussing on carbs, and will take whatever fat and protein comes with them. This is only a short-term thing, though. At some point in the not-too-distant future I'll reintroduce overt proteins and fats.

 

[Lucyr]

Thanks!

It's only unconventional from the perspective of the treatment du jour.

I'm trying to follow a high-carb, low-fat, plant-based plan. I have failed an embarrassing amount of times, but I feel confident this time.

The plan is pretty loose, as I don't do overly well with heavy restrictions, at least not for too long at a time. But it's really a combination of a lot of plant-based plans, with a nod to 'Eatwell', the govt. guidelines and the ADA guidelines.

Really interested to hear how this goes for you as I’ve heard low fat plant based is a possible option for diabetes, and one that would suit me far more than low carb.

 

[Satan’s little helper]

Ok, gotcha!

From what I can gather (Was listening while doing other things) there is no firm position on protein being 'key'. I'm also not sure about this idea that most people doing keto are getting success because it is also high-protein. Perhaps i've misunderstood or just didn't hear. However, it seems that most T2D on keto are prioritising fat. In fact, a recent move by a 'key player' in the keto movement, towards a higher protein (For satiety's sake), lower-fat & lower-carb approach, is causing huge ructions amogst the low-carb diabetic community.

As for me and my own plans? For the moment I'm avoiding all overt protein (Nicola refers to them as 'primary') and pretty much all overt fat. Im focussing on carbs, and will take whatever fat and protein comes with them. This is only a short-term thing, though. At some point in the not-too-distant future I'll reintroduce overt proteins and fats.

I’m going to be waving Pom poms from the sidelines. But could you at least tell us how long have you been diagnosed & if any prescriptions for your diabetes is used?

 

[JITR]

As for me and my own plans? For the moment I'm avoiding all overt protein (Nicola refers to them as 'primary') and pretty much all overt fat. Im focussing on carbs, and will take whatever fat and protein comes with them. This is only a short-term thing, though. At some point in the not-too-distant future I'll reintroduce overt proteins and fats.

Sounds good, thanks.

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

Low fat and plant based does seem effective for some people @beating_my_betes

In recent weeks I’ve seen links offered to ‘Forks over Knives’ for reading around that approach, and examples of people for whom it has worked well. (I confess I’ve not read into it, so know little more than that). I gather it is an approach that seeks to reduce insulin resistance.

 

[beating_my_betes]

Really interested to hear how this goes for you as I’ve heard low fat plant based is a possible option for diabetes, and one that would suit me far more than low carb.

Thanks! There's been an interesting development, so August should be an interesting month.

Hopefully I'll be able to clear up any doubts.

 

[beating_my_betes]

could you at least tell us how long have you been diagnosed & if any prescriptions for your diabetes is used?

5-6 year, no medications. If I'm permitted I'd like to commit it all to a thread. Until then, I'm more interested in doing rather than talking about doing.

Thanks!

 

[beating_my_betes]

Low fat and plant based does seem effective for some people @beating_my_betes

In recent weeks I’ve seen links offered to ‘Forks over Knives’ for reading around that approach, and examples of people for whom it has worked well. (I confess I’ve not read into it, so know little more than that). I gather it is an approach that seeks to reduce insulin resistance.

Forks Over Knives is really similar to many of the lower-fat, plant-based options. And while it's not specific to diabetes treatment, people have used it to help them towards remission:

Here's a link to some success stories:

Success Stories Archives

Real people, real results. Click here to read Forks Over Knives' success stories and be inspired by the transformative impact of a plant-based lifestyle.

www.forksoverknives.com

Here's an article that I think is really worth reading. It's an 'outsiders' appraisal of these kinds of modalities:

https://deniseminger.com/2015/10/06/in-defense-of-low-fat-a-call-for-some-evolution-of-thought-part-1/

However, when it comes to diabetes, specifically, it's worth looking into the work of the Mastering Diabetes crew:

Here's a very good interview with the two founders:

Here're some success stories, mixed with work-in-progress journeys:

Success Stories from the Mastering Diabetes Program

Read the success stories from those living with type 1 diabetes, type 1.5 diabetes, prediabetes, and type 2 diabetes – the Mastering Diabetes Program has transformed their lives from the inside out and they are incredibly happy about it.

www.masteringdiabetes.org

And here're some more detailed 'case studies' (Keep hitting "Load More" for more examples:

Mastering Diabetes Blog | Evidence-Based Diabetes Nutrition

Watch and listen to these incredible case studies from the Mastering Diabetes Program – specifically designed to teach you how to reverse insulin resistance, lose weight permanently, gain energy, reduce your cholesterol, and reduce your chronic disease risk.

www.masteringdiabetes.org

What's really great with these, and more specific to insulin resistance, are the transformations of T1D with this program. Their results also have implications for T1D, when it comes to insulin resistance.

Here is just one example, from someone who tried it for six months. It's one thing to hear the theory, but a whole other thing to see how eating tons of carbs, while reducing fat, can increase insulin sensitivity. He includes a comparison chart within the video, which I've screen-grabbed. There are a few more similar comparison charts within the T1D case-studies on the MD site:

Have fun!

 

[Satan’s little helper]

Here is just one example, from someone who tried it for six months. It's one thing to hear the theory, but a whole other thing to see how eating tons of carbs, while reducing fat, can increase insulin sensitivity. He includes a comparison chart within the video, which I've screen-grabbed. There are a few more similar comparison charts within the T1D case-studies on the MD site:

View attachment 31085


Have fun!

I like this YouTuber. However, I use a fraction more of the basal he does. Have very little weight to lose. & have an insulin to carb ratio not disimalar tho what he states on the “mastering variant diabetes.” On my diet choice which basically avoids starch. Also exogenous insulin is absorbed under the skin differently to what a pancreas would push out near the upper colon? (Somewhere in the dark recesses of the abdomen.)

 

[beating_my_betes]

& have an insulin to carb ratio not disimalar tho what he states on the “mastering variant diabetes.” On my diet choice which basically avoids starch.

Not sure I understand your point.

 

[Satan’s little helper]

Not sure I understand your point.

I like the guy’s YouTube vlogs & advice as a T1. (He is T1.) However I’m a smaller frame? (No more weight to lose.) Also my exogenous insulin requirements (as another T1.) are similar with the diet I adopted? Your insulin would be manufactured by your pancreas. Mine is injected. (Exogenous.) yours is naturally produced. But I wish you well.

 

[beating_my_betes]

I like the guy’s YouTube vlogs & advice as a T1. (He is T1.) However I’m a smaller frame? (No more weight to lose.) Also my exogenous insulin requirements (as another T1.) are similar with the diet I adopted? Your insulin would be manufactured by your pancreas. Mine is injected. (Exogenous.) yours is naturally produced. But I wish you well.

I understand the differences between exogenous and endogenous, and how you and I differ. I was specifically referring to the part I quoted.

 

[beating_my_betes]

@everydayupsanddowns Further to my post above, I wanted to clarify that I don't believe there's any magic to this being plant-based. I don't see why the same results couldn't be achieved while still including animal-products. There are various reasons to reduce the quantity of these, but as long as they fall in with the fat guidelines, and consideration given to overall energy balance, it should still work.