• Please Remember: Members are only permitted to share their own experiences. Members are not qualified to give medical advice. Additionally, everyone manages their health differently. Please be respectful of other people's opinions about their own diabetes management.
  • We seem to be having technical difficulties with new user accounts. If you are trying to register please check your Spam or Junk folder for your confirmation email. If you still haven't received a confirmation email, please reach out to our support inbox: support.forum@diabetes.org.uk

Lantus and high morning blood sugar levels.

Status
This thread is now closed. Please contact Anna DUK, Ieva DUK or everydayupsanddowns if you would like it re-opened.
mark1975 said:
...During the night is where the problems begin! They are dropping most nights up to 6 mmol but never to hypo levels (so far).

My morning levels are always higher than when I went to bed by anything from 2 to 10 mmol.

The higher my levels are when I go to bed, the closer my morning levels will be to them and the biggest drop during the night occurs.

The lower my levels are when I go to bed, the higher my morning levels will be and the smallest drop during the night occurs.

I hope this makes sense!
Click to expand...

Not quite sure I'm following it! You say your levels are dropping most nights by up to 6, but that if you go to bed on highish levels you wake on similar levels - does this mean that you are testing in the middle of the night, have dropped by 6 but then risen back again by waking time? Similarly for the lower level before bed - do you test in the night to see if you are potentially hypoing and rebounding? This would explain the higher levels in the morning. Or if your levels are lowish before bed are you having a snack which then keeps your levels OK during the night, but then you rise again in the morning?

Sounds to me like you have the right amount of lantus for your waking hours, but too much at night so would benefit from splitting into two doses - or, as suggested changing to levemir in two doses as it tends to be better than lantus for splitting.
 
Here's a couple of examples, both times I had no supper and went to bed/got up at the same time.

Before bed: 13.3
2.30am: 7.7
Waking: 11.2

Before bed: 8.1
2.30am: 6.8
Waking: 11.4
 
mark1975 said:
Here's a couple of examples, both times I had no supper and went to bed/got up at the same time.

Before bed: 13.3
2.30am: 7.7
Waking: 11.2

Before bed: 8.1
2.30am: 6.8
Waking: 11.4
Click to expand...

Well, I'd certainly put the waking levels down to dawn phenomenon, given those readings, but the differences in falls overnight are perplexing! When you take your bedtime readings are you always sure that you have no fast-acting insulin still circulating i.e. it is at least 5 hours since you injected any? Did you eat similar meals at similar times both evenings?
 
The meals contained similar amounts of carbs and were eaten at the same time.

The before bed tests were taken around 4 hours after my evening meal so I guess the Humalog could still be tailing off?

I think one night when my before bed levels are spot on, I'll have to do a test every 2 hours to see exactly what's happening.

I'm seeing a DSN on Wednesday (at long last!) and I have a spreadsheet of all my levels, carbs and dosages to bring so hopefully a change in my long acting might occur, I don't mind splitting my long acting if that's what it takes to sort these levels out.

Thanks to everyone for their help and I'll keep you all updated!
 
I never found it so, but I think Patti (member here and over on DSF) found Humalog had a real 'sting in the tail' with a burst of activity between 4 and 5 hours.
 
I wonder if you eat your largest meal at tea time and are still digesting before bed? Do you eat proportionately more fat or protein at tea or are you eating tricky foods such as pizza or pasta. What are your 2 hour post tea readings? If they are ok your lantus may not be lasting 24 hours and splitting might be best.

The mornings look like dp to me. Do you test before you get out of bed or before eating. Levels can sometimes rise just by standing up.
 
Dump the Lantus. Ask to change to 2 x Levemir. It's far easier to manage even though it's 2 jabs, you can see what's happening within 12 hours, no waiting around half the week. I always describe Lev as 'far more biddable' than Lantus.

I fannied about with it for a year, splitting it; different timings, you name it I tried it. I still had to go to bed with a BG near enough 10 in order not to hypo and if I reduced it I'd have mega highs sometime or another.

Within 3 days of starting Levemir I could see the light at the end of the tunnel; some tweaking ensued, but I could always see the results almost immediately, so it just makes it easier to keep track of.

And by the way - you can get a pump via your GP. Pumper Sue did it.

Ask him - if you want one!
 
pgcity:

I eat my dinner around 6pm most days, then go to bed around 10pm. Pasta based meals my levels tend to drop then rise, pizza and more fatty meals they tend rise quickly then level off for quite some time before dropping, rice/potato based meals they tend to rise then drop within 2hrs.

I wake up most days at 6.30am then test and eat straight away.


trophywench:

I'm definitely going to ask the DSN on Wednesday about changing to Levimar & split the dose (the extra jab a day doesn't bother me) or if I can go onto a pump.

Last night before bed: 10.2
2.30 this morning: 8.2
When I woke: 14.1

After the weekend I'm going to do some 3am & 5am tests to see what is happening then.

Thanks
 
And don't forget - INPUT are there when/if you reach a brick wall on the pump issue.
 
mark1975 said:
pgcity:

I eat my dinner around 6pm most days, then go to bed around 10pm. Pasta based meals my levels tend to drop then rise, pizza and more fatty meals they tend rise quickly then level off for quite some time before dropping, rice/potato based meals they tend to rise then drop within 2hrs.

I wake up most days at 6.30am then test and eat straight away.


trophywench:

I'm definitely going to ask the DSN on Wednesday about changing to Levimar & split the dose (the extra jab a day doesn't bother me) or if I can go onto a pump.

Last night before bed: 10.2
2.30 this morning: 8.2
When I woke: 14.1

After the weekend I'm going to do some 3am & 5am tests to see what is happening then.

Thanks
Click to expand...


Mark, looks like you would do brilliantly on a pump.

Not only could you set an (almost infinitely tweakable) basal profile to tame your rampant DP, but your understanding of how your body absorbs different meals means you are well placed to experiment with Dual Wave/Square Wave snazzy bolus options which can deliver different parts of a meal dose at different rates over several hours based on your understanding with what your body is likely to do with that meal's carbs.
 
Thanks for everyone's help, support and advice.

I'm going to start a separate topic as I have a few questions about pumps.

I'll keep you all updated.
 
mark1975 said:
Here's a couple of examples, both times I had no supper and went to bed/got up at the same time.

Before bed: 13.3
2.30am: 7.7
Waking: 11.2

Before bed: 8.1
2.30am: 6.8
Waking: 11.4
Click to expand...

Mark,

I'm seeing the same thing over night.

I'm also seeing a significant fall early evening where my BS is falling 2 to 2.5 points between 17:00 and 18:30. Not ideal if I am late leaving work.
 
Status
This thread is now closed. Please contact Anna DUK, Ieva DUK or everydayupsanddowns if you would like it re-opened.
Back
Top