Have you had delayed ambulance care for diabetes?

[Amigo]

I totally support your campaign Lynn and have personal experience of delays that could have been life threatening but not necessarily connected to diabetes.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said it's not just about protocols Owen. I know you're often on the sticky end of these decisions and people are bewildered that we no longer receive the ambulance response of yesteryear. It's about demand exceeding resources and in that situation they'll be fatalities. The cases we've read on the thread were clearly emergencies and badly graded. There's always far too many ambulances parked outside A&E trying to 'off load' their precious cargo safely and at times the emergency departments can't cope either.

I've had sepsis twice and it's a much much greater risk in diabetics. In my situation I got someone to take me but it's not advisable or possible in many other situations. I'm wondering how the technicians grading risk can accurately assess that risk when patients ring unless they can supply all their observations like b/p, pulse, oxygen sats, temp, BG level and infection analysis. I could give them all those plus my current WBC. Sepsis can kill in hours and doesn't often involve chest pain or breathing difficulties, bleeding or the other emergency indicators assessed over the phone. All some patients can say is they feel absolutely dreadful and that won't get you an ambulance!

I hope this campaign is successful and know the ambulance service feel similarity concerned about the situation. It is broken and for a number of reasons not just connected to protocol.

 

[lynn hurford]

Hoe can we sign your petition?

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/188800/sponsors/9rtLReKImARUIWFFFZW5

I fell very ill a couple of years ago - some sort of virus. It started on Boxing Day and continued through the New Year, so just about the worst time to get ill. I was unable to keep down any food or drink - literally even a sip of water would result in me losing more liquid than I could consume 😱 I struggled on for a while, giving myself small corrections of insulin, but reached a point where I knew I was in danger - I was severely dehydrated, I lost over a stone in weight, I was terrified of overcorrecting because I would not have been able to keep any hypo treatment down, so my BG was between 12-20 most of the time. My ketones went up to 6.4 and so I called 999. I live alone and knew that if I fell unconscious no-one would find me. I explained everything to the call handler who passed me along to the ambulance service nurse. She told me to contact my DSN. The DSN could not have told me anything that I didn't already know and wasn't already attempting to do for myself, but they were insistent that was my only option, so I contacted her. She suggested seeing my GP! I managed to get an emergency appointment and the GP prescribed me some anti-sickness pills. I queued at the pharmacy next door, which was packed, and when it finally came to my turn the pharmacist told me that the prescribed medication had supply problems and they didn't have any 😱 I immediately went back into the surgery and was fortunate to catch the GP I'd just seen as she was on her way out. She took me back into the room and gave me an anti-sickness injection.

The injection did seem to help a little and I was able to sip water, sometimes without bringing it back up. I also managed to nibble on a few crisps and this helped to reduce my ketones (mostly dietary ketones, due to starvation). I managed to get some of the pills a couple of days later and gradually recovered over the following week to 10 days. I had not eaten properly for 4 weeks and not drunk anything for about three weeks - something I didn't think possible. When I told my consultant about it a couple of months later he was horrified at the fact they had not sent an ambulance, given all my circumstances

This was about 5 years after I was diagnosed, and thanks to the knowledge I had gained over those years I had some idea of what was happening and how to keep myself alive, although there was a point - when the pharmacist told me that there were no pills - when I didn't just feel like I was dying, I actually wanted toe, I was so desperate Without that knowledge I probably wouldn't be writing this now I knew what DKA was like, because I had it when I was diagnosed in 2008 - on that occasion I had called 999 and got a fast response car inside 5 minutes and an ambulance 5 minutes later. Move the calendar on a few years and I got nothing

I'm gobsmacked that even your GP just prescribed anti sickness tablets then an injection.
even more shocked that the 999 call handler suggested to call the DSN.
We only call for ambulances for an emergency which clearly yours was as you needed intravenous fluids! its not as if you were ordering a dominoes pizza. Whole system needs a bloody good shake up. glad you pulled through x

 

[lynn hurford]

I totally support your campaign Lynn and have personal experience of delays that could have been life threatening but not necessarily connected to diabetes.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said it's not just about protocols Owen. I know you're often on the sticky end of these decisions and people are bewildered that we no longer receive the ambulance response of yesteryear. It's about demand exceeding resources and in that situation they'll be fatalities. The cases we've read on the thread were clearly emergencies and badly graded. There's always far too many ambulances parked outside A&E trying to 'off load' their precious cargo safely and at times the emergency departments can't cope either.

I've had sepsis twice and it's a much much greater risk in diabetics. In my situation I got someone to take me but it's not advisable or possible in many other situations. I'm wondering how the technicians grading risk can accurately assess that risk when patients ring unless they can supply all their observations like b/p, pulse, oxygen sats, temp, BG level and infection analysis. I could give them all those plus my current WBC. Sepsis can kill in hours and doesn't often involve chest pain or breathing difficulties, bleeding or the other emergency indicators assessed over the phone. All some patients can say is they feel absolutely dreadful and that won't get you an ambulance!

I hope this campaign is successful and know the ambulance service feel similarity concerned about the situation. It is broken and for a number of reasons not just connected to protocol.

thank you for your reply Amigo, again the more my story is getting out there many diabetics are mailing me with there stories and experiences with every
ones help I and diabetes uk can push this forward
I'm sticking my feet in, I wont give up.

 

[lynn hurford]

Good luck with your quest and I hope you manage to achieve what you want from the situation.

Thank you for your support

 

[Owen]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/188800/sponsors/9rtLReKImARUIWFFFZW5

I'm gobsmacked that even your GP just prescribed anti sickness tablets then an injection.
even more shocked that the 999 call handler suggested to call the DSN.
We only call for ambulances for an emergency which clearly yours was as you needed intravenous fluids! its not as if you were ordering a dominoes pizza. Whole system needs a bloody good shake up. glad you pulled through x

Sadly people do ring for the wrong reason. I had a diabetic whom forgot to take their insulin out with them on a drinking binge. A few points and pizza resulted in high blood sugar's and him calling 999. But an isolated incident but quite common. 999 I've got hiccups. 999 I've got a splinter. These are all true calls. I have a regular who is awaiting a double amputation and always falls the day of her community meet up, it's cheaper than calling a taxi. Sadly over 80% of calls are from people not receiving ongoing support from chronic conditions such are ultimately avoidable. Diabetics are no different from anyone else. The are good ones and bad ones. I rarely meet the good ones.

 

[Northerner]

But in all of this story you knew you were ill way before the need for an ambulance. You needed treatment and this was ignored.
Perhaps we as individuals need to be more proactive, I don't really know. But at the moment it but to the point that you needed an ambulance, you were already very ill. Hyperglycaemia builds up hypoglycemia is sudden.

Sorry @Owen, I don't follow what you are saying

 

[Owen]

Sorry @Owen, I don't follow what you are saying

In a blunt format which I tried to avoid, early recognition of illness which you had, along with proactive medical support which was absent, would have prevented an emergency situation.

 

[Wirrallass]

I fell very ill a couple of years ago - some sort of virus. It started on Boxing Day and continued through the New Year, so just about the worst time to get ill. I was unable to keep down any food or drink - literally even a sip of water would result in me losing more liquid than I could consume 😱 I struggled on for a while, giving myself small corrections of insulin, but reached a point where I knew I was in danger - I was severely dehydrated, I lost over a stone in weight, I was terrified of overcorrecting because I would not have been able to keep any hypo treatment down, so my BG was between 12-20 most of the time. My ketones went up to 6.4 and so I called 999. I live alone and knew that if I fell unconscious no-one would find me. I explained everything to the call handler who passed me along to the ambulance service nurse. She told me to contact my DSN. The DSN could not have told me anything that I didn't already know and wasn't already attempting to do for myself, but they were insistent that was my only option, so I contacted her. She suggested seeing my GP! I managed to get an emergency appointment and the GP prescribed me some anti-sickness pills. I queued at the pharmacy next door, which was packed, and when it finally came to my turn the pharmacist told me that the prescribed medication had supply problems and they didn't have any 😱 I immediately went back into the surgery and was fortunate to catch the GP I'd just seen as she was on her way out. She took me back into the room and gave me an anti-sickness injection.

The injection did seem to help a little and I was able to sip water, sometimes without bringing it back up. I also managed to nibble on a few crisps and this helped to reduce my ketones (mostly dietary ketones, due to starvation). I managed to get some of the pills a couple of days later and gradually recovered over the following week to 10 days. I had not eaten properly for 4 weeks and not drunk anything for about three weeks - something I didn't think possible. When I told my consultant about it a couple of months later he was horrified at the fact they had not sent an ambulance, given all my circumstances

This was about 5 years after I was diagnosed, and thanks to the knowledge I had gained over those years I had some idea of what was happening and how to keep myself alive, although there was a point - when the pharmacist told me that there were no pills - when I didn't just feel like I was dying, I actually wanted to die, I was so desperate Without that knowledge I probably wouldn't be writing this now I knew what DKA was like, because I had it when I was diagnosed in 2008 - on that occasion I had called 999 and got a fast response car inside 5 minutes and an ambulance 5 minutes later. Move the calendar on a few years and I got nothing

OMG Northerner, what an awful experience you unfortunately had to endure, that is just terrible & I'm sorry you didnt get the response you needed at that time. What does amaze me is how you found the strength, in your state both mentally & physically, to get yourself from your home to your doctors surgery - maybe you were driven by fear & dread, I don't know. But thankfully you lived to tell the tale & I truly hope you never, ever have to go through anything like that again. Take care.

 

[L020577]

Hi I’ve just joined this website on coming across about the delays in ambulances .Last November 2016 my brother became unwell with his diabetes, we called for a ambulance.It took 4 more calls to 999 from us saying that my brother was geting a lot worse,but sadly no ambulance came for another hour and 15 mins,in that time my brother sadly passed away.He was just 47

 

[Northerner]

Hi I’ve just joined this website on coming across about the delays in ambulances .Last November 2016 my brother became unwell with his diabetes, we called for a ambulance.It took 4 more calls to 999 from us saying that my brother was geting a lot worse,but sadly no ambulance came for another hour and 15 mins,in that time my brother sadly passed away.He was just 47

Very sorry to hear this @L020577

 

[Pumper_Sue]

Hi I’ve just joined this website on coming across about the delays in ambulances .Last November 2016 my brother became unwell with his diabetes, we called for a ambulance.It took 4 more calls to 999 from us saying that my brother was geting a lot worse,but sadly no ambulance came for another hour and 15 mins,in that time my brother sadly passed away.He was just 47

I'm so sorry to hear this my condolences to you and your family.

 

[Copepod]

Hi I’ve just joined this website on coming across about the delays in ambulances .Last November 2016 my brother became unwell with his diabetes, we called for a ambulance.It took 4 more calls to 999 from us saying that my brother was geting a lot worse,but sadly no ambulance came for another hour and 15 mins,in that time my brother sadly passed away.He was just 47

Sorry for your loss, L020577. Welcome to the forum.

 

[Wirrallass]

@LO2057 This should never have happened ~ on both counts. I send you & your family my deepest sympathy ~ and welcome to our forum ~ hope we can help you with any amount of queries you may have. Take care x