Fasting.....

A

AntDon

Member
Relationship to Diabetes
Type 2
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
 
AntDon said:
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
Click to expand...
Im not type 2 in type 1. But the truth is generally different for different people in the way your body reposes I want try and advise otherwise as it's not my area and hold type 2s will be along.
 
AntDon said:
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
Click to expand...
You've come to the right place if you want to get to the truth. Welcome to the Forum.

I reversed my T2 (remission is usually the preferred word) by shedding some weight, adopting a low carbohydrate diet and starting an exercise regime. Others have done the same, although it isn't a given. Some manage it, others don't, even when they're doing the exact same things. I'm one of the lucky ones. I didn't (and don't) fast, unless you count the 10 hours or so between my evening meal and breakfast.

With an HbA1c of 48 you should be able to turn things around by making some lifestyle changes, principally around diet. A low carbohydrate diet is generally considered to be less the 130g per day. Most people eat at least twice that.

I wouldn't consider YouTube in general to be a credible source of information, nor would I take any notice of Dr Google unless it's from a reputable site such as Diabetes UK.
 
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If you do fasting I do 16:8 in essence it puts you in calorie deficit which then allows weight lost which will help sugars I find 2 meals a day is enough and don't have need to snack either
 
AntDon said:
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
Click to expand...
Fasting may help some people but the best option is finding a way of eating that is enjoyable otherwise it will not be sustainable, it has to become a new way of eating. Some find a low carbohydrate approach successful in both losing weight if they need to and reducing blood glucose. I found following the principals in this link worked for me, https://lowcarbfreshwell.com/
Some find the low calorie or a shakes based regime will give them a kick start which they follow up with a more flexible way.
As you are only just over the threshold into the diabetic zone some modest changes should do the trick.
 
I’ve done the same as @Martin.A and found the low carb approach relatively easy to follow. Ultimately, losing weight will contribute massively to lowering your HbA1c level. How you go about that is very personal but it HAS to be sustainable for the long term or it will be too easy to slip back into old eating habits.

I guess people do have success with fasting but it wouldn’t be my cup of tea. I love food way too much to restrict myself to that level.
 
AntDon said:
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
Click to expand...
Hi @AntDon, welcome.
Remission is possible for some people and given you have just crept into the diabetes range you have a very good chance of lowering your HbA1c result through weight loss. Research has shown that even people with a healthy BMI can lose some weight (fat) around the liver and this can help towards remission. Do you have much weight to lose? Lots try a low carb intake to lose weight, others try general healthy eating. Fasting might be something you can try but definitely not for me haha. Good luck with things and keep us posted on what you decide to do! :D
 
Welcome to the forum @AntDon

Sorry to hear you’ve had such a confusing introduction to T2, and you are right, as helpful as the internet can be, it can also be a mess of claim and counterclaim. And it can feel bewildering.

It might help to stick to fairly well-established sources which regularly review up to date research and offer a balanced view.

There is no one single dietary approach that is guaranteed to work (or even appeal!) to everyone. So in a way it’s natural that there are a number of approaches that people find effective. And each approach will have it’s supporters and occasionally forthright evangelists!

But the important thing is for you to find a method that works for you - and gves you the results you are looking for.

At an HbA1c of 48mmol/mol it seems likely that some fairly modest tweaks may be all that is required.

There are some basic hint and tips in this downloadable e-book, which you might find helpful

And a variety of different meal plans here

Meal plans and diabetes

Eating nutritious, healthy and downright delicious food is that bit easier with our meal planners. We've created multiple different weekly meal plans to suit all types and tastes. They're nutritionally balanced, are calorie and carb counted, and can help if you want to lose weight. They also...
www.diabetes.org.uk www.diabetes.org.uk
 
AntDon said:
Hi All New here
New diabetic...

Only just here 48mmol/mol

A lot of conflicting info everywhere.......
Youtube is full of people insisting that type 2 is reversible with fasting.....
Google is full of websites insisting that fasting is really bad for diabetics....

And the advice on diet everywhere is so contradictory as to be ridiculous

How does anyone ever get to the truth????
Click to expand...
Test your blood glucose after meals to see how you react to various foods and ways of eating. You can draw your own conclusions then as you can't really argue against your own numbers. I eat at 12 hour intervals except on the days I only eat once, because I am not hungry.
 
Drummer said:
Test your blood glucose after meals to see how you react to various foods and ways of eating. You can draw your own conclusions then as you can't really argue against your own numbers. I eat at 12 hour intervals except on the days I only eat once, because I am not hungry.
Click to expand...
So you are saying for example you would eat at say 8 in then just another meal at 8 at night?
I would find that hard and you say the days you are not hungry may I ask what keeps you full?
I struggle with three meals a day and sometimes even then give in as I do not sleep. I am on low carb.
I would love to control my hunger I really would.
 
Nayshiftin said:
So you are saying for example you would eat at say 8 in then just another meal at 8 at night?
I would find that hard and you say the days you are not hungry may I ask what keeps you full?
I struggle with three meals a day and sometimes even then give in as I do not sleep. I am on low carb.
I would love to control my hunger I really would.
Click to expand...
Yes, I eat morning and evening - I don't stick to exactly 12 hours, but today I just had a cup of coffee when I woke up and have not eaten anything yet - it isn't anything I do deliberately, I just don't feel hungry. I rarely feel full - I don't like the sensation anyway, but I am simply not hungry.
As I am going out tonight I'll have something to eat fairly soon - probably some tuna and coleslaw with some salad stuff as I'll be going to the shops tomorrow, probably. If I don't go I'll be able to have beef and stirfry from the freezer, so not a problem.
 
Fasting helps get blood sugar down quick, simply because you are not putting anything into your body to raise it. The only way you would/could get a blood sugar spike is therefore because of acute stress. After about 36 hours or so, you have exhausted most of your glucose supply and your liver will start to dump glycogen. Do this often enough, and you will definitely see results, as your average amount of spikes would be negligible, therefore causing a lower A1C test result.

However, for most people that is too difficult and not really sustainable long term. So they go low carb as often as possible and add some exercise.

I had a friend who only ate like 6 eggs a day for like a month. I'm talking no other foods. Eggs and water. He said he got thin and his skin got so tight bones would show. He said it was not healthy long term, but he is very athletic, lean and in really good health.

Dr. Jordan Peterson said he reversed his health issues by becoming carnivore. Only eats beef I believe.

Just play around with things and see if they work. Something usually will.
 
Admiral Benbow said:
Fasting helps get blood sugar down quick, simply because you are not putting anything into your body to raise it. The only way you would/could get a blood sugar spike is therefore because of acute stress. After about 36 hours or so, you have exhausted most of your glucose supply and your liver will start to dump glycogen. Do this often enough, and you will definitely see results, as your average amount of spikes would be negligible, therefore causing a lower A1C test result.
Click to expand...

No, not really true. The liver produces a fair amount of glucose every hour, and some people with T2 can't use their own insulin well enough to keep levels normal, especially if they have insulin resistance that causes the liver to produce it when it doesn't need to. Hence fasting levels are higher than normal.

The body will use glycogen while not eating (Once the glucose from the meal has been processed and levels have returned to normal - glucagon is generated when levels are low and this stimulates the release of glycogen) to keep blood sugars at the steady state, but over time the generation of glucose will be from gluconeogenesis which is glucose made from proteins and fats. In fact, overnight gluconeogenesis rate increases steadily.

There's a constant stream of background glucose when nothing is coming in from food, either via glycogen release or gluconeogenesis.
 
@harbottle I think @Admiral Benbow is talking about longer periods of fasting (ie days) where the liver gets seriously depleted rather than just 16:8 fasting when the liver can renew it's stores on a daily basis. Not that I would in any way recommend that.
 
His claim is wrong, though. Glycogen - which is how the body stores glucose - is used to top up glucose as soon as post-meal levels fall, and over time, if fasting, gluconeogenesis will start to become to the main provider of glucose in blood stream. Both pathways are triggered by glucagon which is released when blood sugar drops when no dietary glucose is incoming.
 
harbottle said:
No, not really true. The liver produces a fair amount of glucose every hour, and some people with T2 can't use their own insulin well enough to keep levels normal, especially if they have insulin resistance that causes the liver to produce it when it doesn't need to. Hence fasting levels are higher than normal.

The body will use glycogen while not eating (Once the glucose from the meal has been processed and levels have returned to normal - glucagon is generated when levels are low and this stimulates the release of glycogen) to keep blood sugars at the steady state, but over time the generation of glucose will be from gluconeogenesis which is glucose made from proteins and fats. In fact, overnight gluconeogenesis rate increases steadily.

There's a constant stream of background glucose when nothing is coming in from food, either via glycogen release or gluconeogenesis.
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Im always higher in the morning is this something i can change?
i know you eat twice a dY but id never cope .
i agree with you as if i starve it increases. i did this at first though to see if it would lower so i d then allow myself yo eat. it increased and came down after i ate.likewise after Breakfast. Id been walking around all morning so i know it was not just movememt that caused it to rise.
 
Nayshiftin said:
Im always higher in the morning is this something i can change?
i know you eat twice a dY but id never cope .
i agree with you as if i starve it increases. i did this at first though to see if it would lower so i d then allow myself yo eat. it increased and came down after i ate.likewise after Breakfast. Id been walking around all morning so i know it was not just movememt that caused it to rise.
Click to expand...
If you are Type 2 and not taking insulin there seems to be very little you can do to suddenly reduce morning blood glucose levels. But by keeping your day time levels under good management then morning ones will start to be lower hopefully.
You really are still early days and it is easy to become impatient.
 
Leadinglights said:
If you are Type 2 and not taking insulin there seems to be very little you can do to suddenly reduce morning blood glucose levels. But by keeping your day time levels under good management then morning ones will start to be lower hopefully.
You really are still early days and it is easy to become impatient.
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No , I just want to do my best. At 49 from 108 i am really quite pleased.
However it could easy climb back the other way if i do not try.
So yes i am sticking to low carb but as not on insulin Ill just stick with it.
Thank you.
 
Nayshiftin said:
No , I just want to do my best. At 49 from 108 i am really quite pleased.
However it could easy climb back the other way if i do not try.
So yes i am sticking to low carb but as not on insulin Ill just stick with it.
Thank you.
Click to expand...

You have every right to feel very proud of the work you have put into that reduction @Nayshiftin
 
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