Do i have any sort of a case or not against the DVLA?

[James130185]

I have posted before regarding this but not to this extent as i am in more of a position now to explain the full extent of it than i was before.

A little bit on myself, I'm 34 years old and was diagnosed as a type 1 diabetic in mid July 2018, My license is basically my job, as i am a bus driver, and as a result of been diagnosed with type 1, i ultimately had my license revoked and was told i could reapply for it once i had 3 months worth of readings on my meter to show i was in control, Obviously i was devastated enough that i was told the diagnosis at the hospital, but to have lost my license and job with it put a great deal of stress on myself as well as my family as we have young children.

So over time numerous appointments with the diabetic nurse and consultant over my newly diagnosed condition and to explain how to use my novorapid and tresiba and dosages etc, cutting that section short my diabetes nurse when going back for a review after a 3 months on insulin was very happy that my readings and my hba1c had come down brilliantly from where it was before and so was discharged from the clinic and my consultant has insisted that if i continue the way i have done over the past few months that he will probably see me one more time and if the results are still good then he will discharge me too, Still following me? good, so now onto my problem with the DVLA.

I sent off my application to have my PSV license reinstated, so as i could go back to doing what i did before back in mid October 2018, and having been told by at least 3 different people when filling out my form before i sent it off from the DVLA that all they needed was my application and a print out of my readings for the previous 3 months, to which i thought great should'nt be a problem, It took them over a month to simply tell me over the phone that they needed me to see my GP for some form of medical before they could progress my application, this then took another 2 weeks for me to see someone regarding it but also over a week to get an important letter from them regarding what it is they specifically wanted ( Why do they insist on sending important documentation taking over a week to get to you?) Having then seen my GP who also had no problem with anything shown to him, blood readings plus other results from previous tests he sent the paperwork off and i thought that was it.

I then get another letter a few weeks later stating that they now need me to see an independent diabetes specialist or otherwise they wont be able to process it any further, now from me having my license revoked up until recieving that letter this is now 5 months, by this point i am getting very angry and frustrated, everyone is telling me that they are happy with how i am dealing with my condition and you even sign a declaration when first applying stating that you are happy for them to speak to the relevant people if needed surely saving you the time having to attend numerous appointments etc, obviously not.

I speak to someone at the DVLA voicing my displeasure, some of them literally not giving a damn about your situation, and then luckily dropping onto someone who does, he then insisted that if when i attend this appointment to see the diabetes specialist i get them to fax the results off rather than post then it will be dealt with on a priority basis because of the fact that come me attending that appointment, which was on the 9th of january it will have been 6 months since having it revoked, i still was'nt pleased as my employer was getting pretty impatient now because i was essentially holding onto a position that i could'nt do and stopping someone else from having that job, because they did'nt think it'd take this long.

I attend the appointment on the 9th of january, for what would be a full medical, and come the end of it the independent diabetes specialist, who is at the top of his game as a professor in this subject, says that i am at very low risk and that he would be very suprised if i did'nt get it back, he then tells me to get in touch with the DVLA later that afternoon to check that the fax had gone through.

I ring the DVLA later that afternoon to be told by someone that it can take "upto 4 days" for it to be placed on the system, not exactly a priority, but left it at that.

I then ring up today expecting it to have at least been looked at considering the time its taken so far, to have someone called Tim basically talk over me telling me in a tone i could not tolerate much longer that i have not been waiting that long on the grand scale of things and that in as many words i should just shut up and deal with it, I explained to him that do you honestly think 6 months soon to be approaching 7 is acceptable to regain something that is essentially your livelihood and that would he be impressed if someone told him he cant do his job or support his family because of the ridiculous amount of time it takes them to look at something, to which he replies that its none of my business on anything to do with his circumstances and continues talking over me.

Ironically the very person they appoint as the DVLA independant diabetes consultant also says to me that my GP who i attended the appointment before him that the DVLA also wanted me to see was'nt in a position to be going through anything specific with my condition as they are not trained to deal with it hence why people get sent to specialists, so why did the DVLA waste £100 of taxpayers money sending me to the GP when really they should have saved time and money and sent me to the Specialist instead, someone they've also paid £100 to??

I'm sorry that this has dragged on, but i am very very frustrated, i am no wiser as to whether i have my license or not, The DVLA think they can essentially play god with peoples livelihood and have not the slightest care on your situation or how long it'll be before they look at it, instead give a standard response of "it takes as long as it takes", I dont know if whether when or if i get my license back to i have any sort of case against them for any sort of loss of earnings or none acceptable waiting times when they can take your license away and respond back in less than a week when telling them of a condition but yet can take months or longer if your wanting something from them, OR am i simply wasting my time and ranting for nothing as it'll get me no where?

Again sorry this has been quite a long comment, and anybody that thinks they can tell me more or advise me on what course of action to take then i'd appreciate it very much.

 

[mikeyB]

The delay may be that you don’t fulfil one of the important criteria, that is that you have not had significant hypoglycaemia for the last 12 months - you haven’t been diagnosed long enough. In a situation like that, they have to be ultra careful in issuing a licence, so the decision is probably grinding its way through higher levels. Don’t get cross with the people you speak to on the phone, they don’t play any part in the progress or decision making in the claim, they can only tell you what stage it’s at.

It’s only since 2011 that Type 1s were allowed Class 2 licences.

 

[James130185]

I only got angry with the person i last spoke to because i didn't like his tone on the phone, I was simply asking him for an update, instead he went off on one on how I haven't been waiting that long.

Everyone has their own opinion on what they consider "long" but the past 6 nearly 7 months i have hated, not simply because of losing my job, but i have struggled to accept the diagnosis too.

 

[trophywench]

I'd say the answer to your question is No, probably not. They aren't inconveniencing you deliberately from any malice aforethought - it just takes a long time is all. Even 70 yos wanting to retain ordinary car licences have trouble when they have certain medical conditions and face long delays - over a year in some cases.

They had me waiting over 6 months once - and in the finish the whole delay was caused by the fact I'd simply accidentally omitted answering one question on the form.

They have never been renowned for their efficiency ever since they closed all the local offices, whether it's sticking your personalised registration number on your new vehicle, getting a UK reg on an imported brand new vehicle or anything else at all.

 

[James130185]

But as i have already said, even the person who they appoint as the DVLA independent diabetes specialist says himself that GP's are in no position to comment on cases like this as they don't have the specific training, so have spent £100 of taxpayers money for nothing so therefore is a waste of time, I may be sounding impatient and i am but when losing your license affects everything else with it, it had a detrimental effect on your life

 

[mikeyB]

That is a misapprehension of what GPs do in driving licence cases. They are the first port of call for all medical cases. For example, if we look at epilepsy. A driver could tell the DVLA he has few fits, his condition is well controlled, and has never had a daytime fit. If the GP has referred the same patient to a neurologist bacause his medication wasn’t suppressing daytime fits, then the GP information is vital, because there won’t be up to date hospital information. You don’t need specialist knowledge of every possible condition, you just answer the questions they ask.

It’s unusual for a GP to contact the DVLA to suggest removal of a driving licence, but I have done it, though only after discussion with the patient.

 

[Pumper_Sue]

I only got angry with the person i last spoke to because i didn't like his tone on the phone, I was simply asking him for an update, instead he went off on one on how I haven't been waiting that long.

That must have been the same chap I spoke to regarding my licence (12 weeks from start to finish) Everyone else was fantastic though.
Do complain though as 7 months is unacceptable.

 

[James130185]

Thank you all so far for your replies, I am appreciative of any comments good or bad, I can see where your coming from mikeyB, I am guessing your a GP then? I was originally misdiagnosed as a type 2 diabetic back in 2015 apparently all my results from tests were not leaning towards any specific one either type 1 or 2 but it was only until around the start of 2018 that i rapidly lost weight without trying so that was when i was officially diagnosed as type 1 in July, something that now I understand the condition better meant that i was never type 2 in the first place, but that's all been and gone now and am happy to be at least getting what i need medication wise.

The independent diabetes specialist was very firm on the fact he wasn't happy that a type 1 patient should be discharged regardless of whether i am in control or not and when i told him that he was more than welcome to speak to the consultant who sees me more often his words were "I'm not about to go telling Dr ******* how to do his job" which kind of felt pointless him making that comment in the first place if he wouldn't question the other consultant?

And yeah Pumper_sue he come across as very arrogant, didn't listen to my side of anything, just kept chuntering on about how they only got the application in october and that it's only january so it's not been long, my response was that what about the 3 months prior to that where it was revoked before October? That might be out of his hands but that's still 3 months extra that i have struggled financially as a result of losing my license.

But i think it's the general efficiency of the DVLA in general, the forms they hand out are nothing more than tickbox exercises on a 1 fits all basis, then on the occasions i have rang you are hit with a brick wall and the standard response of it takes as long as it takes, that for me is understandable to a point, but when does that it cross the line when it's taking too long? Again that's a debatable opinion everyone will have.

The system is flawed, in my opinion the DVLA know they can hide behind the excuse of "we have to be careful when issuing licenses out" and i am sure that's the case, but i wonder how many times that excuse is handed out because theoretically nobody is going to question that are they?

 

[mikeyB]

I refer to my earlier post. The DVLA rules on T1 and driving require a 12 month history of good control, and working round that is a judgement call that would have to made by a senior medical advisor at the DVLA based on all the possible available evidence.

So what is acceptable? 7 months? Four months? Two months as a T1 on insulin? You decide. I can’t.

The other thing to remember is when our licence decisions were made, the DVLA had at least twice the workforce doing the same amount of work.

 

[James130185]

But the rules they send when revoking your license are very clear, at least when looking at the paperwork i received, because i had only just been placed on insulin at the time i couldn't provide "3 months" readings that they specifically required to assess my application hence why it was revoked, nothing i read or was explained to me about 12 months and of it was i wouldn't have been as angry about the whole situation?

Also these senior medical advisors at the DVLA are either no more qualified or even less qualified than the particular specialists they send you to in the first place so despite asking for all medical information from the people they require it from can still override someone that's even more qualified than they are despite been told that the patient is low risk.

For some jobs out there this would have been nothing more than a type 1 diagnosis and to attend regular appointments to understand and look after the condition on a day to day basis and as far as the jobs concerned no major impact as long as it's looked after, but for people whose sole income relies on that license then their entire lives are turned upside down, jobs lost, mortgages with no means of paying etc etc, and there's not a single system in place to cater for that for at the very least until the dvla has made their decision.

How long do i think is acceptable? Again debatable.

The lack of people working for these goverment agencies is not my problem, my immediate problem is myself and my family and the lack of a job to maintain that family, I won't be the first and i won't be the last to encounter something like this and if anything that is something i am definitely sure of.

 

[mikeyB]

I fully understand your plight, James, and sympathise. I agree, you won’t be the first and won’t be the last - it is a recurring theme on the forum. I was trying to explain the delays, not to forgive them.

With regard to finance, go the Citizens Advice Bureau who will advise you on any help which might be available to you.

And the senior medical advisers at the DVLA won’t gainsay the opinion of a specialist they have selected, so don’t worry about that.