Calorie restriction for long-term remission of type 2 diabetes

[Drummer]

Real ice cream is made like real custard, from cream and eggs, warmed until it thickens and then cooled and beaten to the point it is about to set, then flavour or sweeten, or mix in some frozen fruit and watch it set - a small amount of alcohol makes for a softer set. You can use the stuff you put in icing - begins with g - can't remember the name, I've a head full of cotton wool from the feel of it, which also keeps it softer - colourless liquid. It is actually low carb - but expensive to make.

 

[silentsquirrel]

Real ice cream is made like real custard, from cream and eggs, warmed until it thickens and then cooled and beaten to the point it is about to set, then flavour or sweeten, or mix in some frozen fruit and watch it set - a small amount of alcohol makes for a softer set. You can use the stuff you put in icing - begins with g - can't remember the name, I've a head full of cotton wool from the feel of it, which also keeps it softer - colourless liquid. It is actually low carb - but expensive to make.

glycerine?

 

[Drummer]

glycerine?

That's it - I kept thinking glycol - but knew it was wrong.

 

[Eddy Edson]

I hate avocado. The reason why birds never eat avocados is because it is deadly poisonous to birds - that’s the tree’s defence. The Guatemalan variety, which is the main one sold in the UK, is particularly poisonous. It’s a substance called persin that kills them.

Persin is a fat soluble fungicide that leaches into the fruit from the seed. It kills rabbits, and makes many domestic animals ill, plus horses, cows, pigs and presumably any animals in the wild that eat it. In rabbits they die due to cardiac arrhythmia, the other animals get mastitis and bowel problems. Never ever allow your dog or cat to eat any avocado, or the skin, you’ll have a house full of poo and vets bills.

It’s allegedly considered safe for humans, though as it is fat soluble, you won’t wee it out. Don’t know where it goes.

Anyway, it’s cytotoxic, so they are trying to make an additive from Persin to go with Tamoxifen in breast cancer.

All toxic substances have an LD50 - the dose that kills half the population. It’s usually tested on animals. I can’t find an LD50 for persin, presumably because it kills every animal they test it on.

But don’t mind me, enjoy your avocados. I, along with most of the animal kingdom, don’t think it is food. I’m not pushing my luck eating cytotoxic chemicals, thank you very much.

More for us! You can have my bacon.

I guess you won't be wanting those nuts either? Full of cyanide and aflatoxins!

 

[Madeline]

I’ve got an ice cream maker stashed away at the back of a cupboard somewhere, I’m really glad I didn’t get rid, it’s amazing being able to eat ice cream.

@mikeyB that is just about the best excuse ever for not eating avocados

 

[mikeyB]

More for us! You can have my bacon.

I guess you won't be wanting those nuts either? Full of cyanide and aflatoxins!

Indeed. Though with Almonds, it’s the devastation of the Californian water table - it takes 15 litres to grow one almond, and that’s where 80% of world production is. They should have stuck with oranges.

Aflatoxin, a fungus that grows on nuts, causes liver cancer. It’s destroyed by heating.

I’m not totally convinced by eating seeds, either. Plants that have exposed seeds are expecting birds to eat them, and poo them out elsewhere to distribute the plant. We can’t digest tomato seeds - that’s why you see tomato plants growing around sewage outlets. You would have to eat a pint glass full of seeds to gain any nutritional benefit, and even then about a third will wend it’s way out the rear end. That’s how nature works. Playing the percentages.

If you don’t believe me, find a virgin piece of earth in the garden, and bury some poo in a hole, not too deep to see what grows.

 

[mikeyB]

Forgot to add, Eddy. Sloths consume avocados with no ill effects.

 

[Madeline]

I vividly remember one delightful school trip to the local sewage farm (Why? Why would you subject 30 bored and immature kids to an afternoon talking about poo?), they told us they fought a constant battle against rogue tomato plants.

 

[Madeline]

Also, v fond of sloths. Only the two toed ones though, the three toed are sort of sinister serial killer looking.

 

[Northerner]

So, my aversion to avocados is a defence mechanism? 🙂 Only tried them once, a similar number to the times I have eaten tripe 😱

 

[silentsquirrel]

Several times over the past few years I have bought an avocado when on offer, feeling I ought to try and acquire a taste for them, healthy fats and all that. I then spend a couple of weeks trying to summon up courage to try it, then chuck it in the bin with relief when it is obviously mush........

 

[Eddy Edson]

Forgot to add, Eddy. Sloths consume avocados with no ill effects.

As do we. There is zero evidence & zero reason to suspect that persin from avocados is a risk for humans. See eg every competent body which has offered an opinion on the matter.

On Californian almonds: I probably don't really know any more about this than you do, but I really doubt that the water burden is as great as it would be for similar nutrient loads from alfalfa->hay->meat/dairy or from fruits (pace Mother Jones).

The bigger issue IMO is whether so much agriculture of any type should happen in most of California. Same for where I live.

This table from the recent EAT-Lancet study is interesting:



(Table 7 in the SI). In light of that, it's seems quite likely that replacing fruit orchards with almond growing would be positive for water burden, but anyway AFAIK the major shift has been alfafa (->hay->meat/dairy)->almonds, which would almost certainly be a big positive.

For seeds: obviously, some you need to grind for digestibility, some you don't. Eg: Flax grind, chia no need. From personal experience, I get 300 - 450 cals per day from chia seeds. If I wasn't digesting their nutrients, I'd be wasting away, which I'm not. And if seeds in general were not a good nutrition source, it wouldn't be the case that they are recommended by many (all?) expert nutritional bodies, unless you believe they are in the pay of the Global Seed Lobby 🙂

No idea about tomato seeds. Don't recall ever seeing them recommended as a food?

PS: The EAT-Lancet study https://www.thelancet.com/action/showPdf?pii=S0140-6736(18)31788-4

Free access.

 

[Madeline]

I’ve got snow peas and sunflower seeds arriving soon, I’m going to have a go at growing some microgreens on the kitchen windowsill

 

[Eddy Edson]

I’ve got snow peas and sunflower seeds arriving soon, I’m going to have a go at growing some microgreens on the kitchen windowsill

Snow peas are triffic - munch on them all day!

 

[Madeline]

Can’t wait for them to get going! Never tried sunflower greens, they’re supposed to be quite nutty

 

[mikeyB]

Yes, they are extra rich in chlorophyll. Great if you are a plant, but taste great and hardly any carbs.🙂