Balance March-April 2013

[Northerner]

Thanks for the response Joe. Are you permitted to disclose how much Diabetes UK spends on its multiple language provision (ie. translation and printing costs)? I admit my objections are based on a probably incorrect assumption that we're looking at several thousand pounds.

Is there also any research available on the number of people in the UK who cannot speak English and have diabetes?

Also, given that the NHS now recommends non-English speakers use Google Translate for their own website, is there any reason in particular why it's still not considered appropriate for Diabetes UK to make the same recommendation?

I presume you're using the census number of non-English speakers? Out of those who have English as their second language, how many do you think could adequately discuss the ins and out of diabetes and its treatments, risks and complications? I have a degree in Russian and an A level in French, but I'd struggle to hold any meaningful conversation on such a complicated medical topic without getting at least several things hopelessly wrong or misunderstood. And the same goes for any machine translator with current technology.

Anyway, if you have Google Translate access then you also have access to the DUK translations!

 

[DeusXM]

Out of those who have English as their second language, how many do you think could adequately discuss the ins and out of diabetes and its treatments, risks and complications?

I wouldn't like to speculate. I would point out though that the leaflets we're talking about aren't actually that in-depth and deal with the basics. I would also add that those who have difficulty do not sit in splendid isolation and probably have access to friends and family who can help.

Once again, I understand the principle of providing information in a broad range of languages, even if I don't agree with it (my personal view is if you want to live in Britain and can't speak a British language, tough, but that's not relevent to this).

I just think it's a particularly common trait to overestimate the need for this kind of service which is why I'm interested to know what planning and budget has gone into this activity - if it's a very cheap exercise to do, then great. If it's not, has it been done according to a solid business case?

 

[trophywench]

I don't think this is the place to discuss it and I say this because in any doctor's surgery you go into there is now a list on the wall of every language their HCPs speak, plus a list of those languages they will (cos they have to!) provide a translation service for.

We aren't just talking eg Asian or African languages here - Polish and Czech for instance.

As UK healthcare has to be all inclusive no matter your native language - eg undiagnosed T1 French lorry driver goes into DKA overnight in his cab or motel room at the Truckstop at Carnforth perchance? then he has to be adequately catered for, until he can be repatriated, doesn't he?

And I can have quite a decent conversation with a native French speaker about the weather or the price of fish - but not hypoglycaemia or DKA - what's French for 'injection' for starters? Not part of my O level course!

You have also to bear in mind that amongst certain nationalities, unbelievable though it may be to you and I - certain ailments and bodily parts are quite taboo so apparently (as reported in Balance not so long ago) someone Ghanaian would not be able to discuss diabetes with family or friends and a Chinese lady might not be able to discuss her periods (I've plucked the Chinese half of that out of the air but I do know for a fact there is a problem with some nationalities in discussing endometriosis with ANYONE - HCP or not - that's something to do with a perceived slur on their ability to conceive and the fact that your family's genes produce imperfect goods)

Any of these people may speak English better than you or I but because of ingrained upbringing - still can't discuss stuff so you have to try and get through to them, don't you?

There's enough native British in denial about their health and if you find a way of getting through to other monority groups, well maybe it could signpost the way to get through to those as well?

 

[DeusXM]

As UK healthcare has to be all inclusive no matter your native language

Firstly....why?

Ever been in a Polish hospital?

I have. They don't have leaflets in English. Some of their staff MIGHT speak English but there's certainly an expectation that you'll need to be able to speak Polish. Go further afield and you'll be very lucky if you get by - I've had to act as an interpreter between a Thai medic and a French woman injured on a hillwalk as the medic could speak Thai and broken English, and I can speak English and broken French.

Secondly....even if we accept that a state-funded healthcare system has to provide language support for every nationality under the sun....why on earth should a privately-run charity have to do the job for them?

As I said before, if this work is low-cost, I don't see the problem. But if a lot of cash is being spent on this sort of thing and thus diverting away from the cure research budget, I'd object pretty strongly. Particularly as last time I asked Diabetes UK about funding promising cure research, they told me they only fund projects based in the UK. Fair enough, but if that's the attitude being taken, it seems very hypocritical to me to then start funding healthcare information for those who might not even live here.

 

[megga]

I don't think this is the place to discuss it and I say this because in any doctor's surgery you go into there is now a list on the wall of every language their HCPs speak, plus a list of those languages they will (cos they have to!) provide a translation service for.

We aren't just talking eg Asian or African languages here - Polish and Czech for instance.

As UK healthcare has to be all inclusive no matter your native language - eg undiagnosed T1 French lorry driver goes into DKA overnight in his cab or motel room at the Truckstop at Carnforth perchance? then he has to be adequately catered for, until he can be repatriated, doesn't he?

And I can have quite a decent conversation with a native French speaker about the weather or the price of fish - but not hypoglycaemia or DKA - what's French for 'injection' for starters? Not part of my O level course!

You have also to bear in mind that amongst certain nationalities, unbelievable though it may be to you and I - certain ailments and bodily parts are quite taboo so apparently (as reported in Balance not so long ago) someone Ghanaian would not be able to discuss diabetes with family or friends and a Chinese lady might not be able to discuss her periods (I've plucked the Chinese half of that out of the air but I do know for a fact there is a problem with some nationalities in discussing endometriosis with ANYONE - HCP or not - that's something to do with a perceived slur on their ability to conceive and the fact that your family's genes produce imperfect goods)

Any of these people may speak English better than you or I but because of ingrained upbringing - still can't discuss stuff so you have to try and get through to them, don't you?

There's enough native British in denial about their health and if you find a way of getting through to other monority groups, well maybe it could signpost the way to get through to those as well?

Well said, i have been to a few places abroad, and i am ashamed to say that i cant speak there native tong, as i m sure most of us have.

And i also dont think this is a place to descuss it any more. This forum is full of helpfull advice, and we have the odd laugh at times, and thats what makes it good in my eyes. So lets leave it at that.
We can all agree to dissagree🙂

 

[Northerner]

Well said, i have been to a few places abroad, and i am ashamed to say that i cant speak there native tong, as i m sure most of us have.

And i also dont think this is a place to descuss it any more. This forum is full of helpfull advice, and we have the odd laugh at times, and thats what makes it good in my eyes. So lets leave it at that.
We can all agree to dissagree🙂

We wouldn't have this forum if it wasn't for Diabetes UK's support, so I'm sure we can agree that that is at least some money well spent! 🙂

 

[AlisonM]

Got my copy in the post this morning. I'll have a look later.

 

[trophywench]

Hee Hee, DUK (who do nothing for us according to some) sent me all the forms for my comments on the latest issue (I'm on the Readers Panel) before the postman dropped it through the door.

Actually reading all the comments from the readers panel on the previous issue's contents is frequently just as entertaining as Balance itself!

Deus - are you perchance the chap who once famously asked

' What did the Romans ever do for us? '

 

[Northerner]

Hee Hee, DUK (who do nothing for us according to some) sent me all the forms for my comments on the latest issue (I'm on the Readers Panel) before the postman dropped it through the door.

Actually reading all the comments from the readers panel on the previous issue's contents is frequently just as entertaining as Balance itself!

Deus - are you perchance the chap who once famously asked

' What did the Romans ever do for us? '

How did you get on the reader's panel?

 

[megga]

How did you get on the reader's panel?

Didn't you read the offer to be on the panel??? it was in the Arabic version lol