Glucomen Day CGM

[PotatoeMash]

Hi everyone,

I've been looking into diabetes tech before my next appointment at the hospital, and have been considering self-funded options in case I can't be offered anything on the NHS.
Something I've come across is the Glucomen Day CGM. It collects BG data every minute, has rechargeable transmitters, etc. making it the most environmentally friendly diabetes thing I've come across, which is a massive selling point for me - especially as most of diabetes management is not very environmentally friendly at all!
It's also slightly better priced than other CGM's and, by my maths, almost comparable with the cost of Flash Libre when it comes to self-funding.

Therefore, I was wondering whether anyone has any experience with this CGM? Or have considered it but opted for something else instead?

 

[Bruce Stephens]

I think Abbott wins points by actually saying what the prices are of their products. Oh, OK, I've finally got to the prices, https://www.glucomendayshop.co.uk/self-funded/

So around 40% higher than Libre (£139 a month), but for a real CGM rather than an FGM, and with test strips (whereas those are extra for the Libre) presumably because this one's calibrated?

I must admit I rather like the simpler Libre system: it's just a sensor and a reader (or phone), with no need for a transmitter. (However, Glucomon has at least made suitable bundles to reduce that part of the confusion a bit.)

I like the idea of a reusable applicator. If you're going to have a transmitter then yes, making that reusable would be good.

When I started using FreeStyle Libre I'm fairly sure this hadn't been launched. Most likely I'd still have gone for the Libre just because the starter kit's cheaper. Maybe not, because it's not that much cheaper and this is a real CGM (with reusable bits). (When I bought one the Libre starter kit was £150 ex VAT, though it's now a bit less.)

I assume the NHS situation is still that this is covered by the (quite strict) CGM guidelines, but given the relatively low cost I guess CCGs would be a bit more lenient? (I'm assuming this is less costly than the likes of Dexcom, but when I last looked their pricing confused me.)

 

[PotatoeMash]

Hi Bruce,

Thanks for your reply. 🙂

On the subscribe system for Glucomen Day, you get the starter kit within your first monthly payment - which includes everything you need for set up (including normal meter for calibration), as well as a supply of everything you could need going forwards (including test stripes for calibration as you say) for £139 per month. Therefore, yearly cost of using the system is (139x12) = £1668.

For Flash, I'd worked out that self-funding and including the vat, you have to buy the starter kit for £159.99, and then after you've used the two sensors that come with this (a 28 day supply), you'll need 24 more sensors to last the year. Each is £57.95. So yearly: 159.99+(24x57.95) = £1550.79
On top of that you'd need some supply of stripes, etc. just for the occasions you might need to finger-prick.

Dexcom G6 CGM also offers a subscribe plan, which I think is cheaper than buying all the bits separately (although I've not done extensive maths to confirm that). With them, the starter kit is £159.00 (one month's use), and from there it's a subscribe system suppling transmitters and sensors at a cost of £159 month, so doing the same maths for comparison: 159x12 = £1908 per year. On top of that you'd need the equivalent supply of stripes as with flash, just for occasions when you might need to finger-prick. The website says Dexcom G6 doesn't need regular fingerstick calibrations.

The difference in cost between flash and Glucomen day per year is £117.21.

But the Glucomen Day CGM is £240 cheaper per year than the Dexcom G6 CGM with the added benefit of data every minute (compared to every 5 minutes with Dexcom), and there's obviously the reusable/eco-friendly element of it.
Although, the Dexcom offers more locations for wear (abdomen, arm or upper buttock) compared to the Glucomen Day which only offers abdomen, and I haven't seen anywhere in my research on the Dexcom G6 about it only being able to be in water for 30 mins whilst bath/swimming, as I've seen with both Glucomen Day and Flash, so maybe the Dexcom G6 is more waterproof...

Anyway, back to the original point, for a full CGM system at an additional £117.21 per year compared to Flash, I was thinking maybe it was worth it, although I completely take your point about how nice and simple Flash is.
Also, I think this is a fairly new GCM to the market. There's little information elsewhere about it other than on the manufacturers website. That's one of the reasons I'm eager to hear what people think, or if anyone out there has got experience of it to date. 🙂

Now that I've written all of that, I hope I've not made a mathematical error!!!

Also, for anyone reading this - I should probably point out, that's all just from my own research of the options. The websites can all be found here:

Why choose Dexcom Continuous Glucose Monitoring (CGM) for Diabetes Management

What is Continuous Glucose Monitoring and how why choose Dexcom CGM for your diabetes management. No finger pricks required.

www.dexcom.com

GlucoMen Day | A. Menarini Diagnostics – diabetes care – diabetes management systems

FreeStyle Libre 2 | Glucose Monitoring System - Diabetes Care

Discover the FreeStyle Libre 2 flash glucose monitoring system. Advanced and easy to use, it offers an innovative approach to diabetes management.

www.freestylelibre.co.uk

Thanks. 🙂

T

 

[Bruce Stephens]

For Flash, I'd worked out that self-funding and including the vat, you have to buy the starter kit for £159.99, and then after you've used the two sensors that come with this (a 28 day supply), you'll need 24 more sensors to last the year. Each is £57.95. So yearly: 159.99+(24x57.95) = £1550.79

Ah, OK. Yes, I was (probably mistakenly) assuming the £139 was ex VAT but likely it includes VAT? (Which would make it around £116 ex VAT). (Since we won't be paying VAT for this kind of thing. I think there are regulations requiring consumer-facing websites and other media to give VAT-inclusive prices, which happens to be unhelpful for this particular niche.)

That makes it much closer in price (presuming I was confusing the VAT).

 

[Bruce Stephens]

But the Glucomen Day CGM is £240 cheaper per year than the Dexcom G6 CGM with the added benefit of data every minute (compared to every 5 minutes with Dexcom),

I doubt the extra resolution matters much, to be honest. Libre records every 15 minutes and that seems fine to me. (Each time you scan it uses a higher resolution to give the arrows, so I assume it's remembering a few minutes of readings at one minute resolution but just not recording those for very long.) Seems quite possible Dexcom do something similar.

 

[PotatoeMash]

Hi Bruce,

Just to check something you mentioned earlier - we don't pay the vat on these products?

 

[Bruce Stephens]

Just to check something you mentioned earlier - we don't pay the vat on these products?

No. [That is, yes, we don't pay VAT for these (just as we don't for glucometers).] When you check out there'll be an option to declare that you have diabetes (or Type 1 diabetes, I forget) and will be using it for that purpose. (Someone buying for someone with diabetes (or one of the other qualifying conditions) can also declare that.)

 

[PotatoeMash]

Hi Bruce,

I had no idea that was the case, I've never tried to buy anything like this. That's very interesting, and possibly does put more in it between libre and glucomenday. I will have to go back over the prices to double check my maths.

Thanks very much 🙂

 

[trophywench]

That's been the case since they introduced VAT and should we buy eg extra BG strips over the counter at a pharmacy (eg you've gone to Skeggy for the weekend and realised your pot of strips you brought with you is empty, and you can't conveniently get to a GP for am emergency prescription) they should have a form which you complete and sign before they ring it up on their till, nett of VAT.

 

[Bruce Stephens]

Yes, and websites that sell stuff that might qualify often provide some easy way to declare that. (The Diabetes UK shop does, for example.)

Last couple of times I've bought something from pharmacies they seemed not to have a form (rather they just made a note of my details) but I'm sure Boots (for example) had a printed form for this. (Maybe HMRC have changed their system and back then they used paper forms and now they're using electronic ones or something.)

 

[Sally71]

The rule is that if the product was designed purely for medical purposes and can only be used as such then you can get the VAT taken off, if it is for more general purposes then you can’t. E.g. we buy pretty pouches for my daughter to wear her pump in, because we get them from a dedicated website and they were designed purely to carry an insulin pump, are the exact size and shape and have a hole in for the tube to go through, and are unlikely to be used by anyone for any other purpose, we can get the VAT taken off. However if we were to buy something like a Spibelt which would do the job just as well, but which was not designed specifically for that purpose and is also used e.g. by runners to put their phones and so on in, we could not get the VAT removed.

On the Libre website it directs you to the VAT declaration before you check out, if you are buying in a shop they should have a paper form for you to sign, I bought some Libre sensors in chemists a few times and did it this way. It's barely more than your name and address so doesn’t take long!

 

[mikeyB]

When I lived on the Isle of Mull, I didn't pay VAT on my stairlift, nor on the adapted bathroom. I haven't paid VAT on any mobility scooter or wheelchair I bought. In fact, I look for every opportunity to skip VAT on anything I buy to make life easier. Is there VAT on Jelly Babies?🙄

 

[Deleted member 27171]

Hi @PotatoeMash

Im not familiar with the product myself but looks good. Also has the option to link to pump if you ever made that move.

Not sure if it is helpful but the Meds&Kit guide has a comparison chart for all the CGM/Flash that might be handy too.

https://www.diabetes.org.uk/resources-s3/2019-11/diabetes-uk-meds-and-kit-2020.pdf

 

[Bexlee]

The libre, self funded, minus the VAT works out at £96.58 per month or £1158.96 per year. It’s easy to use and apply and worth every penny. Not to mention if for some reason the sensor fails Abbot are very good at replacing them. The other thing looks pretty good though.

My GP does prescribe test strips for the libre reader for me AND strips for my other regular finger prick monitor.