I know low carb might be the only way but I don't want to.

[Deleted member 21371]

Blood glucose can vary a lot depending on the type of exercise. Fairly strenuous exercise is likely to boost your blood glucose. This article explains why -

Why Does My Sugar Go Up After Exercise? - Diabetes Health

Low insulin coupled with physical activity stimulates the secretion of several other hormones such as epinephrine, norepinephrine, cortisol

www.diabeteshealth.com

You can exercise in a different way and keep your blood sugars from going up too much. As a general rule of thumb, subtract your age from 180 and aim to keep your pulse around that figure. Example - if your aged 50 them aim for a pulse rate of 130. Slowing the heart rate will encourage your body to burn fat for energy rather than demanding glucose for energy.

That's the recommended rate for strenuous exercise?
I always aimed to get my liver dumping glucose early on, then I could use the rise in blood glucose as I exercised, then get onto fat burning.
And, as a type two, I found the exercise decreased my insulin resistance, so eventually I could use the glucose better, and didn't see rise in BG.

 

[helli]

This article ignores the fact that we become more efficient at using insulin (more insulin sensitive/less insulin resistant) when exercising which is why many of us experience lower blood sugars when exercising. It just depends on what type of exercise and how fit you are at that type of exercise.
The article suggests that strenuous exercise will cause a rise but a hard cycle ride definitely drops mine.
I believe this is because the increased insulin efficiency/sensitivity overcomes the liver dump if I exercise for long enough - interval training causes a rise because the insulin efficiency does not occur.

In addition, because the liver has dumped glucose during exercise, there is less left in the "tank" to dump over the next 24 to 48 hours which is why we often experience lower levels for a day or two after exercise regardless what the immediate impact was.

 

[pm133]

This article ignores the fact that we become more efficient at using insulin (more insulin sensitive/less insulin resistant) when exercising which is why many of us experience lower blood sugars when exercising. It just depends on what type of exercise and how fit you are at that type of exercise.
The article suggests that strenuous exercise will cause a rise but a hard cycle ride definitely drops mine.
I believe this is because the increased insulin efficiency/sensitivity overcomes the liver dump if I exercise for long enough - interval training causes a rise because the insulin efficiency does not occur.

In addition, because the liver has dumped glucose during exercise, there is less left in the "tank" to dump over the next 24 to 48 hours which is why we often experience lower levels for a day or two after exercise regardless what the immediate impact was.

I find I only get a drop in blood glucose after my insulin has kicked in. Otherwise it'll just stay where it is.
The article talks about that in terms of insulin resistance which I suppose is the issue for Type 2s.

 

[TinaD]

I didn't find internal fat was the first to go.
To me, it was more like the last!

Did you get scanned to see? If so maybe you should tell Taylor's research team as it might be worth investigating since he obviously has some people who do not respond to sudden and sufficient weight loss and also explain the TOFI oddity.

 

[TinaD]

Your diabetes vanished?
I thought you were only holding it at bay through extreme low carbing?

I find it interesting that the terms "reversing type 2" and "remission" and "cure" are all bandied about without a clear definition. Presumably all these scientists must know how important it is to be clear? For myself I satisfy the "cure" idea that my GP uses (2 satisfacory HbA1c) whilst to me it is evident that I am holding onto remission (or good control) only by keeping my carbs lower than the average caveman. Dinosaur steak - yes - Apple - no. Hmm maybe that is the meaning of the Adam and Eve story in Genesis?

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Did you get scanned to see? If so maybe you should tell Taylor's research team as it might be worth investigating since he obviously has some people who do not respond to sudden and sufficient weight loss and also explain the TOFI oddity.

No, I did it a time ago, just after the first news was published.
I did a normal slow diet, to reduce my weight significantly, which helped enormously, but it took the rapid weight loss at the end to reverse the diabetes. So, it was either the very low calorie restriction in some way, or the final weight loss.
(Which to be fair, is the only way actually trialled so far, other evidence is anecdotal, unless there are other trials)
A scan of me last week shows I don't have any internal fat on my liver, or spleen, my pancreas was hiding under my colon though!
Apparently it's not uncommon.

 

[TinaD]

No, I did it a time ago, just after the first news was published.
I did a normal slow diet, to reduce my weight significantly, which helped enormously, but it took the rapid weight loss at the end to reverse the diabetes. So, it was either the very low calorie restriction in some way, or the final weight loss.
(Which to be fair, is the only way actually trialled so far, other evidence is anecdotal, unless there are other trials)
A scan of me last week shows I don't have any internal fat on my liver, or spleen, my pancreas was hiding under my colon though!
Apparently it's not uncommon.

Soin the interests of establishing a clear definition: do you still have diabetes (raised blood sugar levels) with a strictly controlled by diet and no medications(remission or good control) or are you able to eat a diet containing a significant amount of carbs without medications, say above 30% of your total calories, without your blood sugar rising (reversal or even possibly cured.?

 

[pm133]

I find it interesting that the terms "reversing type 2" and "remission" and "cure" are all bandied about without a clear definition. Presumably all these scientists must know how important it is to be clear? For myself I satisfy the "cure" idea that my GP uses (2 satisfacory HbA1c) whilst to me it is evident that I am holding onto remission (or good control) only by keeping my carbs lower than the average caveman. Dinosaur steak - yes - Apple - no. Hmm maybe that is the meaning of the Adam and Eve story in Genesis?

Yeah unfortunately getting scientists to agree on anything is as difficult as it is in any other profession. When you mix prestige, money, power and influence you'll find people fighting. Science isn't exempt and seen plenty of examples of this during the pandemic with scientists engaging in unseemly media whoring.

As for these definitions, I suppose it really doesn't matter as long as people are not using these terms to damage or mislead other people.

I'm still holding onto the view that the Adam and Eve story was about sex.🙂

 

[Nayshiftin]

Blood glucose can vary a lot depending on the type of exercise. Fairly strenuous exercise is likely to boost your blood glucose. This article explains why -

Why Does My Sugar Go Up After Exercise? - Diabetes Health

Low insulin coupled with physical activity stimulates the secretion of several other hormones such as epinephrine, norepinephrine, cortisol

www.diabeteshealth.com

You can exercise in a different way and keep your blood sugars from going up too much. As a general rule of thumb, subtract your age from 180 and aim to keep your pulse around that figure. Example - if your aged 50 them aim for a pulse rate of 130. Slowing the heart rate will encourage your body to burn fat for energy rather than demanding glucose for energy.

Thank you that might explain some of it

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Soin the interests of establishing a clear definition: do you still have diabetes (raised blood sugar levels) with a strictly controlled by diet and no medications(remission or good control) or are you able to eat a diet containing a significant amount of carbs without medications, say above 30% of your total calories, without your blood sugar rising (reversal or even possibly cured.?

Well, everyone's blood sugar rises, however my insulin response maintains it within an acceptable "normal" response level.
I don't count carbs, I eat a classic healthy diet, Mediterranean style, low fat, very low saturated fats, but I do maintain my weight through calorie reduction when required, and exercise.
I still (normally) have an annual review, eye test etc. so I am monitored by my GP.

 

[Nayshiftin]

This article ignores the fact that we become more efficient at using insulin (more insulin sensitive/less insulin resistant) when exercising which is why many of us experience lower blood sugars when exercising. It just depends on what type of exercise and how fit you are at that type of exercise.
The article suggests that strenuous exercise will cause a rise but a hard cycle ride definitely drops mine.
I believe this is because the increased insulin efficiency/sensitivity overcomes the liver dump if I exercise for long enough - interval training causes a rise because the insulin efficiency does not occur.

In addition, because the liver has dumped glucose during exercise, there is less left in the "tank" to dump over the next 24 to 48 hours which is why we often experience lower levels for a day or two after exercise regardless what the immediate impact was.

That really makes sense. So I get a dump then I get the benefit so if I keep at it. It should help. I was thinking it was food when maybe its my erratic behaviour as sometimes I am lazy and sometimes overactive

 

[pm133]

Well, everyone's blood sugar rises, however my insulin response maintains it within an acceptable "normal" response level.
I don't count carbs, I eat a classic healthy diet, Mediterranean style, low fat, very low saturated fats, but I do maintain my weight through calorie reduction when required, and exercise.
I still (normally) have an annual review, eye test etc. so I am monitored by my GP.

I meant to ask you before, do you have a rough feel for how many calories and how many carbs you are eating each day? Or do you not keep a record?

 

[Nayshiftin]

I meant to ask you before, do you have a rough feel for how many calories and how many carbs you are eating each day? Or do you not keep a record?

Yes I have Myfitnesspal app set up so I can lose weight. I have lost over 10kg

I meant to ask you before, do you have a rough feel for how many calories and how many carbs you are eating each day? Or do you not keep a record?

 

[Nayshiftin]

Yes I use my fitness pal and since 30 th March I have lost a stone and a half do that’s 2 lb a week at least . So weight wise I am stable . I keep my carbs in check but not as low as 20 so I really don’t know . It’s up and down all the way. I struggle to understand but I am getting there . I do have a lot of pain and it might be the pain killers and tiredness too.

 

[Leadinglights]

Yes I use my fitness pal and since 30 th March I have lost a stone and a half do that’s 2 lb a week at least . So weight wise I am stable . I keep my carbs in check but not as low as 20 so I really don’t know . It’s up and down all the way. I struggle to understand but I am getting there . I do have a lot of pain and it might be the pain killers and tiredness too.

You are doing really well with your weight loss but your glucose levels going up and down is not ideal. Perhaps you need to keep a better record of your carbs per meal, as it might point to some foods which you are particularly intolerant to.
There is no need to be going as low as 20g per day but set yourself something achievable like 15-20g per meal and see how you go. The rice you mentioned that you had 3 tablespoons might well have been 30g carb.
I remember at work we had to set SMART objectives, specific, measurable, achievable, relevant, timeframe.

 

[TinaD]

Well, everyone's blood sugar rises, however my insulin response maintains it within an acceptable "normal" response level.
I don't count carbs, I eat a classic healthy diet, Mediterranean style, low fat, very low saturated fats, but I do maintain my weight through calorie reduction when required, and exercise.
I still (normally) have an annual review, eye test etc. so I am monitored by my GP.

Well done. This is what I hope for in the future. At the moment I cannot manage carbs above 20gms without going outside normal limits - I have lost roughly 30% of my body weight, have a BMI of 22.9 but am still on a low daily steroid dose (hopefully will end tail off in 4 weeks time). Exercise is a bit restricted by heart, COPD and arthritis but I potter well over 10k steps a day - on some days swearing quite inventively. How lovely it would be to have a slice of freshly baked bread...My GP couldn't monitor a donkey race. He thinks 2 clear HbAics means you are cured when, in my case, it may well mean you are banting, a concept he seems unable to comprehend. If Prof Taylor is right I may be able to join you in your Mediterranean gourmet lifestyle one day.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

I meant to ask you before, do you have a rough feel for how many calories and how many carbs you are eating each day? Or do you not keep a record?

I don't want to intrude in others posts, but I don't record carbs. I do have a good feel of calories. Three meals a day, no junk snacks. Not to say I won't eat a Macdonald's, but that is a meal.
My main guide of food is the mirror.
The scales help, but is weight is either fat or muscle. My shape tells me the difference.

 

[Nayshiftin]

You are doing really well with your weight loss but your glucose levels going up and down is not ideal. Perhaps you need to keep a better record of your carbs per meal, as it might point to some foods which you are particularly intolerant to.
There is no need to be going as low as 20g per day but set yourself something achievable like 15-20g per meal and see how you go. The rice you mentioned that you had 3 tablespoons might well have been 30g carb.
I remember at work we had to set SMART objectives, specific, measurable, achievable, relevant, timeframe.

I only had the rice as so in the heat of low carb not working and I proved that again last night as hubby said to finish it and I have a read of 5.8 this morning. It seems to be exercise and not food-related. I do note what I eat and know some things like bread even the Bergen will raise my Blood level but it might be that day at that time. I can start with this and have an omelet and it could be 16 in two hours. I will start the day with 9,5 and go down to 5,8 after the two-hour wait. Unless I buy a libre to see exactly when etc I will not know when it dumps the glucose. Some days I can feel it and somedays my mood tells me the highs are there. My plan is to see the Gp again and maybe be referred to a dietician.

 

[Nayshiftin]

Well done. This is what I hope for in the future. At the moment I cannot manage carbs above 20gms without going outside normal limits - I have lost roughly 30% of my body weight, have a BMI of 22.9 but am still on a low daily steroid dose (hopefully will end tail off in 4 weeks time). Exercise is a bit restricted by heart, COPD and arthritis but I potter well over 10k steps a day - on some days swearing quite inventively. How lovely it would be to have a slice of freshly baked bread...My GP couldn't monitor a donkey race. He thinks 2 clear HbAics means you are cured when, in my case, it may well mean you are banting, a concept he seems unable to comprehend. If Prof Taylor is right I may be able to join you in your Mediterranean gourmet lifestyle one day.

Well done you with your 10k steps per day. I am proud of you for achieving that well done.

 

[Leadinglights]

I only had the rice as so in the heat of low carb not working and I proved that again last night as hubby said to finish it and I have a read of 5.8 this morning. It seems to be exercise and not food-related. I do note what I eat and know some things like bread even the Bergen will raise my Blood level but it might be that day at that time. I can start with this and have an omelet and it could be 16 in two hours. I will start the day with 9,5 and go down to 5,8 after the two-hour wait. Unless I buy a libre to see exactly when etc I will not know when it dumps the glucose. Some days I can feel it and somedays my mood tells me the highs are there. My plan is to see the Gp again and maybe be referred to a dietician.

I think that is a very good idea, as you do need to get to the bottom of the erratic behaviour your body is dishing out. Maybe ask for a referral to a diabetic specialist. They may be able to set you up with a continuous monitor for a period of time to see what is going on, just as they often give people a heart monitor.