Spanish Holiday in July

DunkyHory

New Member
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Type 1
Hi All, I hope someone can give me a bit a guidance. We have a holiday booked to Spain for the end of July which we booked before Corona virus was known about. Ryanair have confirmed our flights are still operating so we can't cancel them. Our hotel was booked on a non-cancelable rate and as such we can't get a refund.

I'm a type 1 (since 1984) and well controlled (HbA1c 42 - 6.00%). However, I don't feel comfortable taking the added risk of a holiday in Spain including flights and staying in a hotel etc. I have two queries I'd like other peoples thoughts on.

Firstly, would anyone feel comfortable going on the holiday in July as a well controlled diabetic.

Secondly, would I be able to claim on my travel insurance on the basis that I'm a type 1 diabetic. I'm not in the extremely vulnerable category but obviously diabetics are generally more vulnerable than the average person.
 

Inka

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I wouldn’t go on the holiday at the moment. Have you tried seeing if you can transfer the hotel booking and flights to a later date?

What did your insurance company say?
 

everydayupsanddowns

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The latest figures released are quite challenging for people living with T1, but the main risk factor still seems to be age, with relatively low risk of death if you get a severe case of cover-19 if you are T1 and 40 or younger. I've not read the paper in detail, but interestingly a low HbA1c seemed to add risk rather than reduce it - but I've not worked out what age group that applies to (as low HbA1c can be more problematic in later years)

It seems like you need to be speaking to your insurance company, or at the very least having a good look at their website and guidance around Covid-19 claims.

As @Robin suggests, it will be hard to know for sure until you know the situation and government advice at the time of your trip I think :(
 
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Docb

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Type 2
Pretti Patel added to the confusion by simply waffling when asked directly about about holidays. Reality is that nobody knows what is going to happen with foreign travel for the forseeable future.

If it were me I would thinking of something else to do at the end of July - chances of this government coming up with something workable in 8 weeks are slim if their track record of getting on top of things early is anything to go by.

And ED&D, I'm not convinced that the increase in risk risk for sub diabetic HbA1c levels is real. It was tiny and more importantly there is no reason for it and it does not follow the trend of the rest of the HbA1c data.
 

ColinUK

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Type 2
Ryanair are saying that they expect to operate 90% of flights in July but whether you can actually fly or not isn’t their call but is dependent on FCO advice. If that advice is that non essential travel is not allowed then Ryanair have to offer you a refund. That won’t be clear until perhaps a matter of days prior to the booked flight.

Your travel insurance will have a clause in it about “disinclination to travel”. Basically it says that if the FCO advice doesn’t categorically mean you can’t go and you want to cancel then you’re exhibiting a disinclination to travel and are not covered.

As for the hotel, if it’s closed as a result of government advice in that country, you should be able to get your money back – provided the hotel stays in business.

If the hotel is open for business and you don’t show up, you’ll probably have to pay for the room, even if the government advice is not to travel and/oryou have no way of getting there because your flights were cancelled.

I knoW you said it was booked as not cancelled but it’s still worth checking the terms if you booked with an accommodation booking site.

Hotels.com is currently offering anyone with hotel stays up to 31 May a full refund or face-value voucher, provided the booking is cancelled at least 24 hours before check in. That date is likely to extend as advice is updated.

Airbnb said that reservations for stays and experiences made on or before 14 March with a check-in date between 14 March and 15 June 2020 are eligible for a full refund, if customers cancel before check-in.

Booking.com is also waiving its cancellations fees for affected bookings.

You should also contact the hotel directly. They are not obliged to offer a refund, but they may given the current circumstances. Or they may agree to postpone your booking.
 

Robin

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Type 1
Your travel insurance will have a clause in it about “disinclination to travel”. Basically it says that if the FCO advice doesn’t categorically mean you can’t go and you want to cancel then you’re exhibiting a disinclination to travel and are not covered.
I think insurance companies would be on a sticky wicket if they tried that, since most of them state that if you travel ‘contrary to foreign office advice' they won’t cover you while you’re away. They can’t have it both ways, much as they would like to! Holidays are not 'essential travel.'
 

ColinUK

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Type 2
I think insurance companies would be on a sticky wicket if they tried that, since most of them state that if you travel ‘contrary to foreign office advice' they won’t cover you while you’re away. They can’t have it both ways, much as they would like to! Holidays are not 'essential travel.'
If. If there’s FCO advice covering the dates of your holiday then fine but if the FCO advice is not clearly stated as converting those dates then not fine. So the advice is to wait until FCO advice covers the dates of travel. If you don’t wait for that then it’s choice to canal as you won’t be covered.
 

Robin

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Type 1
If. If there’s FCO advice covering the dates of your holiday then fine but if the FCO advice is not clearly stated as converting those dates then not fine. So the advice is to wait until FCO advice covers the dates of travel. If you don’t wait for that then it’s choice to canal as you won’t be covered.
I think we are violently agreeing with each other! I said in my original post, wait until a couple of weeks before travel. That’s when most insurance companies will start to deal with holidays and consider current FO advice.
 

ColinUK

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Type 2
I think we are violently agreeing with each other! I said in my original post, wait until a couple of weeks before travel. That’s when most insurance companies will start to deal with holidays and consider current FO advice.
I think we are!
 

Eddy Edson

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Type 2
From what I've read, you would need to self-isolate for 2 weeks after returning under the new UK border controls.

But I'd also be wondering if thing might move further & the requirement change to 2 weeks in a quarantine hotel. That's what happened a couple of months ago here in Oz (it's certainly a major reason why we have just 101 COVID-19 deaths so far).
 

everydayupsanddowns

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Mike,

When you say low, do you mean "good" low or hypo low?

Thanks
it was a case study / anecdote / illustration at a conference about an elderly T2, who had been pottering in the 8’s, and whose medications were changed to try to push Hba1c down towards the ’target‘. Hypoglycaemia, fall, hip fracture, heart trouble and significant other problems followed. Poor guy (If indeed he was real) ended up in a care home.

So yes, broadly its increased exposure to risk of hypoglycaemia, but also risk of cardiac arrythmia and cognitive stuff.

It really clarified the need for individualised Hba1c targets and goals for me. Which I’d always thought important, but not with so dramatic an outcome.
 

Michael12421

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Type 1
The government here says that all visitors to Spain must self isolate for 14 days. So you will be spending your holiday in your hotel. The majority of hotels are still closed and many of them may never do so again, at least this year. Others in tourist areas have been taken over to provide extra rooms for virus sufferers to be treated. If your airline cancels the flight or the hotel does not re-open then there is a good chance that your money will be returned to you - so you should hold on to see if those things happen.
 

Michael12421

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Type 1
If you are willing to tell me which airport you are booked to arrive in Spain, which town/city your hotel is in and even the name of the hotel I will investigate for you the latest information and post it on here. The restrictions here are quite Draconian, face masks are now compulsary and rigorously enforced by the police who are all armed and have no hesitation in using their arms to get you to comply with their instructions. Many police in the tourist areas speak some English but even if they don't then a gun pointed at you and waving you away speaks volumes. Let me know if I can be of further help.
 

SB2015

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Type 1
We have a holiday booked in September. We were told that if we cancelled now we would lose the deposit as it would be disinclination to travel. If we wait and there is still travel restrictions at that time we will be able to move the holiday.
We will be due to make the final payment soon and we will make a decision then based on the situation at that time.

I certainly wouldn’t book a holiday at this time, and I am not certain that I will want to travel in September. We have moved the holiday that we had booked for this coming week to the same dates next year.
 

SB2015

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Type 1
t was a case study / anecdote / illustration at a conference about an elderly T2, who had been pottering in the 8’s, and whose medications were changed to try to push Hba1c down towards the ’target‘. Hypoglycaemia, fall, hip fracture, heart trouble and significant other problems followed. Poor guy (If indeed he was real) ended up in a care home.
Is there any evidence that lower HbA1c in T1 is a problem as you get older, and what is the definition in this context of ‘elderly’?
 

Docb

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Type 2
SB2015, in the data I looked at there was a suggestion that being sub-diabetic HbA1c carried a tiny increased risk when diabetes was looked at having eliminated all other factors. I was not convinced that it was something worth taking into account. In terms of age alone, the risks escalated markedly once you were over 80. The effect of well-controlled diabetes was insignificant by comparison. Ill controlled diabetes, that is a HbA1c over 80, combined with being over 80 years of age I suspect would lead to a significantly increased risk but my understanding of the statistical methods is not good enough to estimate by how much.

Caveat, only really looked at the T2 data but my recollection is that the T1 data followed the same pattern with slightly higher risk factors.
 

mikeyB

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Type 1
If you cancel the holiday now just because you are diabetic, your insurance won’t pay out. You will have to wait for either the airline, or hotel to cancel before you have a claim.

The alternative is going on holiday.

That’s the choice, but I suspect that you won’t be going because of government restrictions both ends of the journey. It’s not exactly a necessary journey.
 

everydayupsanddowns

Administrator
Staff member
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Type 1
Is there any evidence that lower HbA1c in T1 is a problem as you get older, and what is the definition in this context of ‘elderly’?
Mostly I think it’s *how* the very low HbA1c is achieved, and whether or not it is coming at the expense of lots of hypos.
 
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