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should i worry?
- Thread starter bev
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Northerner
Admin (Retired)
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 1
Hi bev,
I would imagine that it was very exciting as well as strenuous, so probably got the adrenalin pumping, which prompts the liver to release an extra boost of glucose energy! Ketones don't show up straight away I don't think, so probably best to do another test after a couple of hours. Also, I would test blood at half-hour intervals to see which way the trend is - if it's still rising then give the DSN a call - although you've probably already done all these things!
Hope things improve shortly. How does he feel?
I would imagine that it was very exciting as well as strenuous, so probably got the adrenalin pumping, which prompts the liver to release an extra boost of glucose energy! Ketones don't show up straight away I don't think, so probably best to do another test after a couple of hours. Also, I would test blood at half-hour intervals to see which way the trend is - if it's still rising then give the DSN a call - although you've probably already done all these things!
Hope things improve shortly. How does he feel?
Thanks Northerner,
He feels ok but has a headache - i have rung the dsn but she want us to test him at lunchtime and then decide whether to give him extra novo or not - depending on what his level is. I vaguely remember you saying that you have had this problem with levels rising after exercise? So is this a common occurance? Thanks. Bev
He feels ok but has a headache - i have rung the dsn but she want us to test him at lunchtime and then decide whether to give him extra novo or not - depending on what his level is. I vaguely remember you saying that you have had this problem with levels rising after exercise? So is this a common occurance? Thanks. Bev
Northerner
Admin (Retired)
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 1
A lot depends on the intensity of the exercise, and I know from experience that playing some of the Wii games can be pretty intense! It's all to do with those stress hormones triggering a release of extra glucose. Normally, on a run, my levels remain fairly steady, but I can get an increase if I push hard - not a very extreme increase in my case though. The fact that the high levels are probably due to this means that they ought to be ok and should come down fairly quickly - the body is more receptive to storing the glucose as glycogen in the muscles after exercise, the important thing is that there needs to be some circulating insulin to 'open the doors' to the cells. If there is little or no circulating insulin then the body (especially the brain) can't use the glucose and so starts to use fats and proteins, which produce ketones as side-effects - once again, the lack of circulating insulin means these ketones aren't 'disposed of' efficiently and their levels increase, turning the blood acidic and leading to DKA.
The surge of adrenalin can cause the headaches afterwards.
Lesson over!
Adrienne
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Parent
Hi Bev
I've emailed you about this on the email list, I was out, sorry, I've given you my phone number as well now.
Northerner is right but missed out a bit of the rules for PE at school (but why would you have been told that)
If a child is over 14.0 then no PE, gym or games. You need insulin in your cells to have energy, this is exactly what Northerner said. So they presume over 14.0 there is no insulin on board and therefore your levels will go up with the release of adrenaline etc.
Now there is a new study out which I learned about in October at an advanced pump training course. This is for pumps and I'm not sure how it could be adapted for MDI. Exercise has been split into two types, non aerobic and aerobic. One lot is continuous ie swimming, cycling, running etc, the other is stopping and starting ie football, athletics etc. There are different suggested rules for each group.
However the one constant rule is if the child has levels over 14.0 then CAN now do PE, gym or games but you need to give a bolus. Now the pump can work out how much it wants to give as a correction to bring the levels down to about 7.0 or 8.0, so you go through the process of this and for example if it wants to give 1.0 unit to lower the levels then you only bolus 0.5 unit. You ignore the insulin on board (it tells you that).
So then you have insulin back in the body and in theory there will now be energy to exercise.
If on MDI I guess you could give an injection of 0.5 unit or 1 unit and see what happens.
Everyone is different and so needs tweaking.
Bev - don't forget when the levels go higher there is more insulin resistence. For example when Jessica is say 15.0 then 1 unit will generally bring her down by 6.5 mmol but if she is over 22.0 I know I have to add on between 0.5 to 1 unit of novorapid as there is resistence there.
No idea whether that has just confused anyone or helped anyone.
I've emailed you about this on the email list, I was out, sorry, I've given you my phone number as well now.
Northerner is right but missed out a bit of the rules for PE at school (but why would you have been told that
)If a child is over 14.0 then no PE, gym or games. You need insulin in your cells to have energy, this is exactly what Northerner said. So they presume over 14.0 there is no insulin on board and therefore your levels will go up with the release of adrenaline etc.
Now there is a new study out which I learned about in October at an advanced pump training course. This is for pumps and I'm not sure how it could be adapted for MDI. Exercise has been split into two types, non aerobic and aerobic. One lot is continuous ie swimming, cycling, running etc, the other is stopping and starting ie football, athletics etc. There are different suggested rules for each group.
However the one constant rule is if the child has levels over 14.0 then CAN now do PE, gym or games but you need to give a bolus. Now the pump can work out how much it wants to give as a correction to bring the levels down to about 7.0 or 8.0, so you go through the process of this and for example if it wants to give 1.0 unit to lower the levels then you only bolus 0.5 unit. You ignore the insulin on board (it tells you that).
So then you have insulin back in the body and in theory there will now be energy to exercise.
If on MDI I guess you could give an injection of 0.5 unit or 1 unit and see what happens.
Everyone is different and so needs tweaking.
Bev - don't forget when the levels go higher there is more insulin resistence. For example when Jessica is say 15.0 then 1 unit will generally bring her down by 6.5 mmol but if she is over 22.0 I know I have to add on between 0.5 to 1 unit of novorapid as there is resistence there.
No idea whether that has just confused anyone or helped anyone.
Caroline Wilson
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
Just wanted to say I hope Alex is OK.
Northerner
Admin (Retired)
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 1
...Northerner is right but missed out a bit of the rules for PE at school (but why would you have been told that
If a child is over 14.0 then no PE, gym or games. You need insulin in your cells to have energy, this is exactly what Northerner said. So they presume over 14.0 there is no insulin on board and therefore your levels will go up with the release of adrenaline etc. ...
Indeed - perhaps Nintendo could incorporate a BG meter into the Wii so it won't work if you're above 14! In theory, I wouldn't go out for a run if BG was over 13, but in practice this has never happened to me - I think 11 is the highest I've been. I was told that I'd need to correct and then re-check before exercising.
Adrienne
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Parent
Ha hilarious
My daughter is frequently over 14.0 especially in the mornings even with pumping. She is a bit different like I've explained before. She hasn't got her pancreas and if people think I'm obsessed, they are right, I am, but I have no choice. Our team at Gt Ormond St have always said that she is the hardest child they have had to control the levels and still is !! She is not the most complicated anymore with the actual condition (congenital hyperinsulinism) but where level control is it is a nightmare as she has about 2% of her 'rotten' pancreas left which is impossible to remove and it won't burn out. Every time I try and treat a hypo so pouring quick sugar into my daughter, her pancreas wakes up and kicks out more insulin even though she may be in the 1's or 2's. I think I am trying to justify my obessiveness.......More detail here (follow links at top of page for more about insulin adjustment)
http://www.runsweet.com/ExerciseChildren.html
Just a quick update.
I gave Alex an extra half unit with his lunch - i didnt want to give him too much in case he plummeted!( he was 22)
2 hours later he was 12- then another hour later he was 4! So i am glad i only gave him the half unit!
It is excellent information Adrienne has given me about the being over 14 and not exercising etc.. I just wish i had know before he exercised as we didnt even test him! We will do in future though!
Thanks for all your replies - dont know what i would do without these sites! Bev
Alex sends a big THANKYOU to you all for taking the time to reply!
I gave Alex an extra half unit with his lunch - i didnt want to give him too much in case he plummeted!( he was 22)
2 hours later he was 12- then another hour later he was 4! So i am glad i only gave him the half unit!
It is excellent information Adrienne has given me about the being over 14 and not exercising etc.. I just wish i had know before he exercised as we didnt even test him! We will do in future though!
Thanks for all your replies - dont know what i would do without these sites!
BevAlex sends a big THANKYOU to you all for taking the time to reply!
sofaraway
Senior Member
I am one of those who needs to give myself insulin before exercising. i give 1 unit before playing football if I am 5-8 (more if higher). It doesn't sound like much but it works, I will then end the game at around 10ish Without that unit I will end the game in the high 20's and feel awful. it has really helped my second half performance, I don't perform well once I hit high teens.
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