• Please Remember: Members are only permitted to share their own experiences. Members are not qualified to give medical advice. Additionally, everyone manages their health differently. Please be respectful of other people's opinions about their own diabetes management.
  • We seem to be having technical difficulties with new user accounts. If you are trying to register please check your Spam or Junk folder for your confirmation email. If you still haven't received a confirmation email, please reach out to our support inbox: support.forum@diabetes.org.uk

Obesity: How prejudiced is the NHS? - BBC2, 9pm 11/4/2017

Status
This thread is now closed. Please contact Anna DUK, Ieva DUK or everydayupsanddowns if you would like it re-opened.
well they've tried drunks, smokers, single mums - so fat folk, had to happen
 
I'll reserve judgement and whilst it would be easy for me to get in a right lather about 'fat discrimination', the truth is it can represent a much greater clinical risk for operations.
Having said that, you'll find the surgeons and anaesthetists much happier to take the risks if you're paying private 🙄
 
Well, I've watched the first 10 minutes and was so incensed by it I switched channels. Why on earth shouldn't NHS staff advise those with excess weight to try to reduce it by a low-carb diet, exercise etc for the derived health benefits it gives. Yes, a few have special genetic problems and these can be spotted and handled the right way, but not the majority.
 
Fantastic programme.

I speak as a very obese individual. I was offered bariatric surgery - but I refused. I am personally dead against it - for me!!

I joined Slimming World, as you probably already know. To date, losing just over 7 stone in 8/9 months. I am learning better portion control, food groups, support from fellow class members. It has suited me.
Hba1c is 37 (5.5%). Cholesterol is 2.8, I am off now Lantus injections, hope to be off Novorapid by the summer, off both meds for high blood pressure. SW has worked for me.

Good luck to those who feel bariatric surgery is the only option open to them - I wish them well, it just did not appeal to me.

Fascinating programme.
 
Last edited:
DaveB said:
Well, I've watched the first 10 minutes and was so incensed by it I switched channels. Why on earth shouldn't NHS staff advise those with excess weight to try to reduce it by a low-carb diet, exercise etc for the derived health benefits it gives. Yes, a few have special genetic problems and these can be spotted and handled the right way, but not the majority.
Click to expand...

I think part of the problem is that the NHS guide people to follow the eat well model rather than low carb diet. This seemed to be what one participant said who was on the NHS weight management programme, she said that despite her saying that she gained on carbs she was still advised to include them largely.

I was going to switch over but I'm glad I stuck with it. I did think though that the emphasis seemed to be saying that the NHS should provide more weight loss surgery but I think they should look at better weight management plans.
 
What would also help is that we are all different and we don't all fit in the same box.
Courses in my area are nil
I got the one of dietician when we thought it was ongoing.
What is this tier 3 she spoke of is this only England as I'm Scotland.
I'd be the one gaining if I ate from the Eat well plate guidelines as that was in fact my diet before.
Not everyone wants this surgery by the way as Hazel has stated.
I'm wondering also of the long term benefits do we know this. I've only seen reports from the American side.
I found it interesting and I hope her voice is heard and more people are offered if they wish but education is needed to but not the eat well plate that needs changing for some but not all.
 
Jangles said:
I think part of the problem is that the NHS guide people to follow the eat well model rather than low carb diet. This seemed to be what one participant said who was on the NHS weight management programme, she said that despite her saying that she gained on carbs she was still advised to include them largely.
Click to expand...
I have to see the programme, but I suppose that NHS is promoting actively an one size fits all dietary advice and therapy, that simply doesn't work for a major part of population.

On the other hand industial food corporation are pushing what is on their interest so are promoting as healthy diet what is healthy for their cash flof, so we are getting gluten free and lactose free fads, preservative filled and calorie packed snacks .
Or costly dieting programs.
 
I did watch the programme...didn't shock...surprise...or disappoint me...much of what was said was expected...of course some NHS services are prejudiced...possibly 'selective' may be a more appropriate term...not just with obese patients...the elderly...socially disadvantaged...groups who's diagnosis is 'fault based' (such as type 2's...many still believe it is their own fault)...any group that does not have a strong 'voice' is vulnerable to cost cutting/selective measures...which I believe in the long term have no economic value...all very well knowing what happens...the difficulty is proving it...wonder how much the NHS would save if it wasn't over burdened with CCG's...joint committees...management teams that seem to bear no responsibility for nonsensical decisions that ultimately lead to higher costs...more social & palliative care...increased GP appointments...more hospital referrals...increased medications... in the long run how does that save money... or benefit patients... for the already overburdened NHS perhaps we should be looking at management structure...hierarchy...administration (or the lack of it)...rather than blaming those in need of help...irrespective of blame.
 
Last edited:
I have not watched yet recorded it.
I too believe that a one size fits all approach does not work.
We are all different.
 
Jangles said:
I think part of the problem is that the NHS guide people to follow the eat well model rather than low carb diet. This seemed to be what one participant said who was on the NHS weight management programme, she said that despite her saying that she gained on carbs she was still advised to include them largely.

I was going to switch over but I'm glad I stuck with it. I did think though that the emphasis seemed to be saying that the NHS should provide more weight loss surgery but I think they should look at better weight management plans.
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree that many patients are given the mad Eatwell Guide diet advice so it's often not their fault, but the Dr/Researcher who made the program should have realised that the NHS dietary advice is madness. She's an intelligent, educated person who has no excuse for not recognising that. Basically she hasn't done her research properly and taken a very narrow and expensive route. We are all different but when it comes to carbs, the greater majority will lose weight when eating less food overall and much fewer carbs.
 
I have just started eating reading Pure,White,And Deadly, by John Yudkin. He started writing about sugar in particular and how it is bad for us in the 70's and how all these years later he is beginning to be taken a bit more serious. He was not taken seriously as Ancel Keys fat is the demon was deemed more credible, though his work is now being scrutinised more closely.
 
DaveB said:
Yes, I agree that many patients are given the mad Eatwell Guide diet advice so it's often not their fault, but the Dr/Researcher who made the program should have realised that the NHS dietary advice is madness. She's an intelligent, educated person who has no excuse for not recognising that. Basically she hasn't done her research properly and taken a very narrow and expensive route. We are all different but when it comes to carbs, the greater majority will lose weight when eating less food overall and much fewer carbs.
Click to expand...
Its not about who's fault it is Dave...the issue was is was/is there obvious prejudice towards obese patients...the obvious answer is...YES (my opinion)...once the damage is done...does it really matter who is to blame...surely the objective should be to offer the appropriate assistance...why on earth is the system selective...whether obese...a road traffic accident...risky sports injury...those that need help are entitled to receive it...I don't agree she has not done her research...very often the truth is unpalatable...I am horrified that any patients in need of treatment...necessary to get them well again...keep them out of hospital...avoid debilitating...chronic...life threatening conditions are denied treatment for the most arbitrary of reasons.
 
Tbh , I think the researcher wasn't blaming people who are obese. She said that there is empirical evidence to show that many obese people lack particular hormones in the stomach that regulate appetite and have too many which increase appetite. She said that that those people benefit from gastric surgery through the reduction of these hormones in addition to the decrease in calories.

She was a very powerful advocate for the patient and I especially enjoyed the piece where she presented her evidence to the panel of GPs and CCG commissioners. I don't think she was advocating an unhealthy lifestyle but was wanting CCGS to be more supportive of diet and exercise programmes but to support surgery for people who may require it.
 
Status
This thread is now closed. Please contact Anna DUK, Ieva DUK or everydayupsanddowns if you would like it re-opened.
Back
Top