NHS trusts call in the bailiffs to chase ineligible patients’ debts

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Northerner

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Three-quarters of NHS hospital trusts in England are using private debt firms to chase treatment costs from overseas patients and refused asylum seekers in a practice branded “inhumane” by critics, the Observer can reveal.

Debt recovery firms have pursued thousands of patients for millions of pounds in recent years, prompting complaints of harassing phone calls and intimidating doorstep visits. The debts relate to the cost of treatment for patients who are ineligible for free NHS care under government immigration rules, which were tightened as a result of the “hostile environment” approach Theresa May initiated as home secretary.

Data released under the Freedom of Information Act shows that 77 of 102 hospital trusts have used private debt firms to pursue ineligible patients. Of 60 trusts that provided patient numbers, 8,468 patient debts were referred to private debt collectors between 2016 and 2018.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ineligible-patients-asylum-seekers-immigrants
 
The NHS is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't.

Only alternative is to refuse treatment to anyone not in possession of an NHS number or some other valid method of paying.
 
trophywench said:
The NHS is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't.

Only alternative is to refuse treatment to anyone not in possession of an NHS number or some other valid method of paying.
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Well, that has often been mooted :(

It's clearly not worthwhile and of course the argument against this sort of thing is that it can dissuade people from seeking help which may lead to greater costs to society overall :( Hostile environment is just wrong, in my opinion :( It's political and unnecessary :(
 
trophywench said:
...possession of an NHS number...
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I didn't even know such a thing existed until about 4 1/2 years ago. And only then 'cause it was on a letter from a hospital.

However, of the 48 trusts that provided full financial details, only about £1.5m of the £21m of debt referred to private firms during those three years has been recouped – barely 7%.
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This bit's interesting. And the article does go on to cover difficulties getting anything, and peoples ability to pay.
 
trophywench said:
Only alternative is to refuse treatment to anyone not in possession of an NHS number or some other valid method of paying.
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That would put drs nurses ambulance staff in a very difficult predicament, could any of us refuse to treat someone who was in need of urgent help, say they were having a heart attack or stroke. The hcp would have to live with the consequences of that decision to refuse, not the pen pushes issuing the orders.

Really don't think debt collectors are the answer either, difficult one.
 
The question I would ask is whether the cost of collecting the debt using debt collectors, together with administrative costs, makes this a worthwhile exercise. It’s hardly a huge drain on NHS finances anyway, and if it comes to having to present photo ID every time you slice your hand carving the Sunday roast it’s a poor do. Specially if you are the wrong colour.
 
Well I absolutely wanted to start a proper debate - I'm no more inhumane to my fellow man than anyone else here.

However - Nye Bevan never envisaged his brainchild trying to provide healthcare to all and sundry - only to the folk who it was envisaged could pay a contribution towards it and their families. But the thing is I do object to money being spent on outsiders when contributors can't get it or have their essential surgery delayed or cancelled because t'other one has come in as an emergency. I have great difficulty in weighing up what I should be or ought to be feeling apart from frustration and fury - neither of which is actually useful.

If I could use that energy to greater purpose - and other folk like me also joined in cos it can't just be me - perhaps we could achieve a meaningful difference?

I'm by no means an 'ideas' person and never have been - but I'm a dedicated 'joiner in' !
 
It's a tough one, isn’t it. Nobody wants to turn away people in need, but how do you discourage 'health tourism' where people travel with the sole aim of obtaining free medical treatment because they perceive the UK as a 'soft touch', but our resources are stretched and rationed and people who have a legitimate claim to treatment have to wait. (and don’t tell me it doesn’t happen. If you lived in a country where medical treatment was less than optimal or too expensive, wouldn’t you try and get free help somewhere else?)
 
I felt very resentful indeed when an African lady came over here specifically to give birth safely to quads, and she did. Though the credit card presented ran to the plane fare ISTR it didn't meet the hospital bill.
 
Health tourism has no measurable effect on waiting lists. While there’s no doubt it does happen, the effect has been grossly exaggerated by elements of the press with a racist agenda. You can bet the house on the press not bothering to report negatively if an Australian woman arrived and gave birth to quads. It would be a happy occasion.

Let’s chill about this, and give the NHS the money it needs to provide a decent health service to all of us. And set up a system to block health tourism to keep the Daily Mail happy.
 
mikeyB said:
Health tourism has no measurable effect on waiting lists. While there’s no doubt it does happen, the effect has been grossly exaggerated by elements of the press with a racist agenda
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I wasn’t particularly thinking of the Daily Fail model, I was thinking of expats, like the father of an acquaintance of mine, who pop back to the UK for their hip replacements etc. They must take someone else’s place on the waiting list.
 
They can’t “pop back” for hip replacement on the NHS unless they have been on the waiting list before. And at least they’ve paid into the NHS while working. No harm in sitting in the sun while you’re on the waiting list.
 
I am against this, it is wrong, it is inhumane and does nothing to advance society.

However, I think payment should be made but I would bill the government of where they were from.
 
I just read an article on the internet the other day about an American ER doctor on holiday in the UK experienceing NHS treatment for the first time. He had to take his son to A&E when he was poked in the eye in an accident. He fully expected to pay after treatment & both he & the doctor were shocked: he for not having to pay & the doctor for being asked for the price of treatment. He eventually left making sure the hospital had his details & credit card number for future billing. Two years later & he never got a bill!🙄

He was saying how he, & a lot of fellow Americans apparently, think the NHS is a socialist, paramount to communist, organisation that can’t be trusted to provide trustworthy care to patients. He DID notice how old the hospital buildings were, how run down looking the interiors & the equipment wasn’t new but, the proffessionlism & care provided from the medical staff was excellent: his eyes were opened!😱🙄🙂😎
 
When I broke my leg in Stockholm I was in hospital for 6 days. I had my own (quite spacious) room, really good meals, superb care, an operation to plate and screw my leg back into shape, and I was even brought a phone that I could use to make international calls from. I didn't have an EHIC card at the time, but this didn't seem to trouble them. About a month after I got home I got a bill from the hospital. I was expecting some huge amount, if not for the operation itself, then at the very least for the phone calls I had made. The bill was....£20! 😱 Apparently just some sort of administration charge, I wasn't charged for anything else 🙂 A highly-recommended venue for a leg-breaking incident! 😱 🙂
 
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