I just wanted to say hi, as I start on this path. I've just read through some of the posts and I'm feeling very encouraged. This is my third week since being diagnosed, with 50. I've been given medication (Metformin and Avorstatin). I haven't started taking them yet. I'd really like to try and reverse this without the medication, particularly the statin which scares me no end. I see lots of other people on this forum are going for it without medication too. The problem is how overwhelming it all is, and there seem to be a million things to read. I'd love a simple guide to different paths I can follow to help me beat this thing. Thanks for having me!
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Newly diagnosed, new member, new life?
- Thread starter Meglorien
- Start date
Quick answer:
1. Dr David Unwin, a GP who has pioneered drug free remission with great success (over 150 patients in remission, 93% prediabetic reversal) recommends this diet:
- https://phcuk.org/wp-content/uploads/A_5_page_low_carb_diet_leaflet_Unwin_2021-converted.pdf
2. What should we eat?
- https://www.zoeharcombe.com/2021/08/what-should-we-eat/
Thanks. That's very useful.
Felinia
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
Hello and welcome. I was one of the people who was given the opportunity to reduce my HbA1c of 57 without medication, and I successfully lowered my blood glucose over 3 months. Then I was ill (unrelated) for several months, my levels shot right up and I ended up having to take medications (but that's another story). You are only just into the diabetic range and hopefully a few tweaks with your lifestyle will prove successful in lowering your glucose levels too. May I suggest you talk to your allocated diabetic nurse about trying that. Without knowing your medical history, they may have had a reason for prescribing Metformin (which can have side effects!!).
Statins are a different matter. Many people take them with no ill effects, but some like me are intolerant of them. For some with other medical conditions, they are considered necessary. I tried 3 different sorts over 18 months, (with just about every side effect) but in the end was taken off them. My GP suggested taking a cholesterol lowering drink which resulted in a 17% reduction, which I have maintained. I am currently waiting to hear if my GP will prescribe a non statin cholesterol lowering medication, so there are other alternatives.
You will have read that every person is different, so we have each had to find what is best for our body. May I suggest that, if you have not already done so, you work your way through the Learning Zone. I did one module a day, starting with food, then exercise, then the remaining modules. That way I could absorb all the information. There are different eating patterns various members use, which I expect you will have read about. I can only describe what I did, and still do.
I decided to try the lower carb approach. It is suggested that lower carb is less than 130gm a day. Some people are very intolerant of carbs and have to have 50gm a day or less. It works for them. I tried that but it did not suit my body and is actually contra indicated for one of the medications. After experimentation I settled on 75gm - 90gm a day. In order to monitor my carb and calorie intake, I got an app which I fill in every morning, so I know the plan for the day. Initially I got a finger prick testing kit, which I used to work out what foods affected my glucose levels. That way I learned what to reduce or avoid. I've found substitutes, for example black bean pasta, roasted squash wedges and lots of cauliflower (mash, riced, with cheese).
I also increased my exercise, do daily stretching exercises and go to the pool twice a week for aquafit. But exercise can be increased walking, cycling, Pilates, yoga, gym.
This is what works for me, but you may find different strategies. I actually enjoyed trying out different things and now cook most of my food from scratch, baking in stock, using my slow cooker for casseroles, and granny's old jam saucepan for soups. You will read that many people feel better than they have done for years and their diagnosis has been an inspiration for a healthier future. Please feel free to ask any questions as nothing is silly. Between us we have centuries of experience.
Statins are a different matter. Many people take them with no ill effects, but some like me are intolerant of them. For some with other medical conditions, they are considered necessary. I tried 3 different sorts over 18 months, (with just about every side effect) but in the end was taken off them. My GP suggested taking a cholesterol lowering drink which resulted in a 17% reduction, which I have maintained. I am currently waiting to hear if my GP will prescribe a non statin cholesterol lowering medication, so there are other alternatives.
You will have read that every person is different, so we have each had to find what is best for our body. May I suggest that, if you have not already done so, you work your way through the Learning Zone. I did one module a day, starting with food, then exercise, then the remaining modules. That way I could absorb all the information. There are different eating patterns various members use, which I expect you will have read about. I can only describe what I did, and still do.
I decided to try the lower carb approach. It is suggested that lower carb is less than 130gm a day. Some people are very intolerant of carbs and have to have 50gm a day or less. It works for them. I tried that but it did not suit my body and is actually contra indicated for one of the medications. After experimentation I settled on 75gm - 90gm a day. In order to monitor my carb and calorie intake, I got an app which I fill in every morning, so I know the plan for the day. Initially I got a finger prick testing kit, which I used to work out what foods affected my glucose levels. That way I learned what to reduce or avoid. I've found substitutes, for example black bean pasta, roasted squash wedges and lots of cauliflower (mash, riced, with cheese).
I also increased my exercise, do daily stretching exercises and go to the pool twice a week for aquafit. But exercise can be increased walking, cycling, Pilates, yoga, gym.
This is what works for me, but you may find different strategies. I actually enjoyed trying out different things and now cook most of my food from scratch, baking in stock, using my slow cooker for casseroles, and granny's old jam saucepan for soups. You will read that many people feel better than they have done for years and their diagnosis has been an inspiration for a healthier future. Please feel free to ask any questions as nothing is silly. Between us we have centuries of experience.
Thank you so much for sharing this with me, Felinia. I have an appointment to talk to an expert about the medication and I will discuss with them the possibility of at least trying to go without to start with. My reasoning is that at this stage will be easier to make real life changes. I think weightloss is where I'm really going to struggle, as I've tried several things over the years and, given where I am now, nothing really stuck or worked properly.
I'm reading up on different approaches, for everything really, from food to exercise. I know myself, I know lifestyle requirements which cannot change, such as my job and family dynamics. So I'm looking at everything to try and find something I can stick to.
My first question, I guess, is whether you were very hungry when you started the low-carb route?
Leadinglights
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
It was the low carb route for me following the principals in the Freshwell approach and reduced my HbA1C from 50 to 42 in 3 months with no medication. https://lowcarbfreshwell.com/. This is low carb but it is not NO carbs, make the carbs you have count for enjoyment and flavour rather than empty carbs. This is now my new way of eating, 3 years down the line I am in normal range of below 42mmol/mol
No I did not feel hungry at all as replacing the carbs with protein and healthy fats, though I was never a 'snacker' anyway.
I would press for being allowed, though it is always your choice, to try diet for 3 months as even with the medication you would need to make the same dietary changes anyway.
Of course there are other options which people try, low calorie, shakes based but whatever you chose had to be enjoyable for you and you need to go into it with a positive attitude not one that is 'I can't do this'
No need for that !!!
Have a look at the Amazon reviews of book mentioned in this copy and paste from yesterday:
One thing you could try is the 5 day Phase 1 of the Harcombe Diet:
https://www.theharcombedietclub.co.uk/JanBlitz/2018/Ph1-whatyoucaneat-jkga.pdf
It's purpose is to put cravings behind you. At least it's written down so you know exactly what to do!
Zoe Harcombe describes Phase 2 in this article;
- What should we eat? https://www.zoeharcombe.com/2021/08/what-should-we-eat/
The section on weight loss has helped me maintain my weight after losing over 20 kg to get back to normal, instead of putting it all back on again and T2D returning with a vengeance.
As you can see from the reviews of her book describing the diet many have suceeded with it after trying other approaches. it's inherently low carb:
- https://www.amazon.co.uk/Harcombe-Diet-Counting-Calories-Losing/product-reviews/1907797114/
Felinia
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
Sometimes, but I upped the protein content of my meals. I have larger portions of chicken and fish, lots more vegetables (mainly non starchy ones) plus when I get hungry, I drink. I suggest you look at the forum Food/carb queries and recipes. Lots of pictures posted to give you ideas. I always have a good plateful!!
One of my medications requires me to drink lots of water. I have a couple of coffees first thing, then drink water (still or sparkling) plus peppermint tea. I estimate I get through about 3 litres of fluid a day.
After a few days, the appetite does decrease.
Drummer
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
I lost loads of weight without any effort as I reduced the carbs and my metabolism seems to have recovered.
The 'healthy' carbs I was eating before diagnosis were just impossible for me to cope with, a few months after going low carb my clothes started sliding south. I thought the elastic must have gone, then realised how my shape had altered.
Thank you all for your experiences. It gives me hope. I'm really stressed!
Thanks in particular about the sites, I've already started reading one of them.
Having a path laid out in simple terms is really helpful, at least while I think about bigger changes. For instance, one plate, half veggie, half other things is helpful. Then the problem is that half veggie also has carbs and protein, so maybe I need a different visual aid, but it will still be better to have that while I give myself time to understand dietary options (like whether it should 6 meals or 3 meals, or how I personally react to different foods, or how to combine the changes I need with the changes my of 5 family can cope with when one of them is a teenage dancer, but also needs to improve diet, and how to include exercise in my busy schedule, and, and, and...).
I'm keen on an emergency plan, as it's really overwhelming to read all the information, while life and work still go on, not waiting for me to figure it all out, so the websites you gave me are being a big help, as is reading your experiences.
You all give me hope that this can be done and it won't be as complicated as it feels right this minute.
Thanks in particular about the sites, I've already started reading one of them.
Having a path laid out in simple terms is really helpful, at least while I think about bigger changes. For instance, one plate, half veggie, half other things is helpful. Then the problem is that half veggie also has carbs and protein, so maybe I need a different visual aid, but it will still be better to have that while I give myself time to understand dietary options (like whether it should 6 meals or 3 meals, or how I personally react to different foods, or how to combine the changes I need with the changes my of 5 family can cope with when one of them is a teenage dancer, but also needs to improve diet, and how to include exercise in my busy schedule, and, and, and...).
I'm keen on an emergency plan, as it's really overwhelming to read all the information, while life and work still go on, not waiting for me to figure it all out, so the websites you gave me are being a big help, as is reading your experiences.
You all give me hope that this can be done and it won't be as complicated as it feels right this minute.
Felinia
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
I feel for you - the initial diagnosis can feel overwhelming but pleased be reassured that if you take it one day at a time you will soon feel more in control. Every person is different so you will slowly learn what suits your own body. Many people have said it was the wakeup call to lead a healthier lifestyle, both for you and your family members. Two well known sayings come to mind "Rome wasn't built in a day" and "It's a marathon, not a sprint"
It's a 'Fight or Flight' reaction.
@Meglorien, your reaction was to fight, 'beat it'. You have already learnt that's not so easy, rather complex in fact.
Flight is much easier, just 'get the hell out of here'. Most newly diagnosed (without complications) and almost all prediabetics can do that. All you have to do is lose 10-15 kg, maybe a bit more.
The NHS and its GPs (with some exceptions such as David Unwin and Freshwell) do not make flight so easy. Although demanding the NHS Pathway to remission is a flight path for some. Another step in the right direction is the NewDAWN project, part funded by Diabetes UK to come up with less demanding diets for losing weight by 2027.
Yesterday evening, spurred on by 'beat it' and radio silence from NewDAWN, I had a look for anything the project manager, Dr Nichola Guess, a smart lady in American parlance, had to say about diet and diabetes. The answer was quite a lot in this video, Best Diets for Type 2 Diabetes. She emphasises the importance of protein (as advocated by Dr Unwin and Zoe Harcombe) and says high protein is the active ingredient in low carb (as advocated by Freshwell and others). Well worth watching for a balanced view of the current 'state of the art'. Her conclusion? Weight loss by any means.
Even better there are two companion discussions with Professor Roy Taylor. He discovered type 2 diabetes, and fatty liver, are reversible by diet in 2008, a breakthrough of global significance. The first is about the cause and the second about reversal. His comments on diet are especially interesting.
All you really need to know to take flight.
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Actually, my first reaction was not "beat it". My first reaction was feeling guilty and ashamed and I was very tempted to just go on a more self-destructive path of totally ignoring it, possibly just taking the medicine I was given without thinking much about it. I took me a couple of weeks of thinking "how can I redirect my anger and lack of care about myself into something a little bit more productive" and trying to recognise that, at the very least, I need to be better to be an example for my children. I read a lot of posts on these forums before joining and then... well then, it's been all rather overwhelming as beating it means an awful lot of changes, some of which I don't even know I'm ready for, but I'm certainly not just looking at losing weight and getting to below the 48 threshold. I want to be healthy. And people in this forum show me it's possible. I've now made a plan for the next 6-8 weeks, while I learn and learn and learn. I have very modest goals.
Thank you for the links. I've been hearing a lot about Prof. Taylor, so I was wondering where to find what he said.
Drummer
Well-Known Member
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 2
@Meglorien With any luck there will be no need to accept modest goals.
Simply reducing my carbs to 50gm a day maximum took me from HbA1c of 91 down to 47 in 80 days.
Psychologically significant, as it is just below the diabetes threshold, I then hit 41 at the next test, 6 months in.
I think I am a very ordinary type 2 - nothing at all exotic, so the low carb was all it took.
Having tried and tried to comply with all the advice on starving, low fat, high carb, low calorie, lots of exercise I got for decades before diagnosis, I found none of them worked to do me any good, then there was Atkins, so on diagnosis, and being so hugely overweight I took it as my road to Damascus moment and refused to let others mess about with my wellbeing any longer. I've been in normal numbers for seven years now.
I sometimes feel a bit guilty as it was so very easy to do.
Simply reducing my carbs to 50gm a day maximum took me from HbA1c of 91 down to 47 in 80 days.
Psychologically significant, as it is just below the diabetes threshold, I then hit 41 at the next test, 6 months in.
I think I am a very ordinary type 2 - nothing at all exotic, so the low carb was all it took.
Having tried and tried to comply with all the advice on starving, low fat, high carb, low calorie, lots of exercise I got for decades before diagnosis, I found none of them worked to do me any good, then there was Atkins, so on diagnosis, and being so hugely overweight I took it as my road to Damascus moment and refused to let others mess about with my wellbeing any longer. I've been in normal numbers for seven years now.
I sometimes feel a bit guilty as it was so very easy to do.
- Relationship to Diabetes
- Type 1
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Prof Taylor was one of the researchers/clinicians behind the DIRECT study, which is a significant and ongoing piece of work which was one of the first pieces of research to talk in clear terms about remission of diabetes being a possibility.
There are two main approaches to diabetes management that are popular on the forum (with many variants among them). One is to focus on weight loss, particularly weight around the abdomen which can indicate visceral fat built up around organs like the liver and pancreas, stopping them working properly. Many members using this approach find that glucose levels improve naturally as their weight reduces - particularly if using a short term intervention such as the Newcastle Diet (Prof Taylor’s protocol).
The other approach is to focus on blood glucose management with a lower carbohydrate way of eating (typically less than 130g of carbohydrates a day). Reducing portions of all carbohydrates, not just the obvious sweet and sugary things, but bread, pasta, potatoes, grains, rice, and many fruits. Many members using this approach find that weight reduces naturally as their glucose levels improve.
Of course there are some that use a combination approach too!
One of the things about diabetes is that it can be very individual. And the same approach may not appeal, or work as successfully for two different people - so it’s really a question of experimentation, and developing a ‘diabetes toolkit’ of strategies and approaches that work for you, and which you can sustain long-term 🙂