End of Week 4 of Newcastle Diet

[mhtyler]

Well, I'm ending week 4 on a weight plateau. Still down 16 Lbs. Although my Wife points out that losing 16 Lbs. in 4 weeks is near miraculous. I've been feeling fatigued so I've increased from 4 shakes to 5 per day. Why? In the UK, the Optifast shakes are about 209 kcals ea., but in the U.S. the closest equivalent is 140 kcals. So 3 Optifast is about 627kcals, but 4 PLNT (that's the kind I use) are only 560. I upped it to 5 shakes or 680 kcals a day, which is nearly 60kcals a day more than Optifast. Over the next 40 days that is an extra 2400 kcals, so I'm talking about extending beyond 8 weeks a few days only. I'm also now taking a battery of vitamins, and electrolytes as well. I feel much better, but plateaus aren't fun. On the bright side my morning glucose is 5.6 mmol/L so that doesn't suck.

At this point I will say that the same shakes day after day is getting quite monotonous. PLNT only has vanilla and chocolate. I'm going to look at adding in some low-calorie soups I've found that fit the bill nutritionally on the one hand, but don't upset the diet apple-cart. My sugar remains in a normal range, although about once a week I get a morning spike. Nothing huge, but instead of being about 5.6 it comes in at 6.1 mmol/L. Now, only a few weeks ago I'd have been thrilled at that reading, but in this situation, it puzzles me. Best explanation; it's rather like a weight plateau, the liver is cleansing itself of fat at different rates, and occasionally it zaps out a bit more sugar in response. So no big deal, right? It's bothersome when you're working this hard though, and this IS hard work, and not for the faint-hearted. The toughest part is wondering if all of this will reverse me, or if will I end up in the category that clears their liver but doesn't restore pancreas function. I have to wait about 6 more weeks to find out via HbA1c test a week after return to normal eating. I soldier on.

 

[harbottle]

6.1 is not a 'spike'.

And well within the error margin of blood glucose.

Well done on the weight loss!

 

[rebrascora]

Congratulations on your fantastic weight loss so far and great readings. Hope you break through the plateau next week.

As said, 6.1 is not in any way a spike and whilst it may seem pedantic to make an issue of that, some people on the forum, particularly newbies, get really anxious about what a spike is and if they read that 6.1 is a spike and it goes unchallenged they may become a lot more anxious. 6.1 is marginally more elevated than your normal waking readings but within the error range of the instrument you are using to measure.
Whilst there is no specific definition of a spike in the context of diabetes and BG levels, it is generally a hard, sharply pointed item and unless you have a graph with very odd axes, the difference between 5.6 and 6.1 is, in my opinion, a molehill that you could comfortably sit on and squash rather than anything which would cause a pain in the backside. 🙄

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

Thanks for the update @mhtyler

And congrats on your progress so far. Hope your plateau begind to gently trend downwards soon and those few extra calories a day help with the fatigue.

Keep going!

 

[AndBreathe]

Well, I'm ending week 4 on a weight plateau. Still down 16 Lbs. Although my Wife points out that losing 16 Lbs. in 4 weeks is near miraculous. I've been feeling fatigued so I've increased from 4 shakes to 5 per day. Why? In the UK, the Optifast shakes are about 209 kcals ea., but in the U.S. the closest equivalent is 140 kcals. So 3 Optifast is about 627kcals, but 4 PLNT (that's the kind I use) are only 560. I upped it to 5 shakes or 680 kcals a day, which is nearly 60kcals a day more than Optifast. Over the next 40 days that is an extra 2400 kcals, so I'm talking about extending beyond 8 weeks a few days only. I'm also now taking a battery of vitamins, and electrolytes as well. I feel much better, but plateaus aren't fun. On the bright side my morning glucose is 5.6 mmol/L so that doesn't suck.

At this point I will say that the same shakes day after day is getting quite monotonous. PLNT only has vanilla and chocolate. I'm going to look at adding in some low-calorie soups I've found that fit the bill nutritionally on the one hand, but don't upset the diet apple-cart. My sugar remains in a normal range, although about once a week I get a morning spike. Nothing huge, but instead of being about 5.6 it comes in at 6.1 mmol/L. Now, only a few weeks ago I'd have been thrilled at that reading, but in this situation, it puzzles me. Best explanation; it's rather like a weight plateau, the liver is cleansing itself of fat at different rates, and occasionally it zaps out a bit more sugar in response. So no big deal, right? It's bothersome when you're working this hard though, and this IS hard work, and not for the faint-hearted. The toughest part is wondering if all of this will reverse me, or if will I end up in the category that clears their liver but doesn't restore pancreas function. I have to wait about 6 more weeks to find out via HbA1c test a week after return to normal eating. I soldier on.

Can I ask you what "normal eating" means for you? The only reason I ask is that that is a really important part of the whole process.

 

[mhtyler]

Thanks for the update @mhtyler

And congrats on your progress so far. Hope your plateau begind to gently trend downwards soon and those few extra calories a day help with the fatigue.

Keep going!

I'm down 18 pounds now, but I'm concerned that my loss rate has so deteriorated that 8 weeks won't be nearly enough to reach my goal of 35 pounds. There's nothing to do about it that I can see but stay the course. i've done a few things about the fatigue issue that I think have fixed it very well. I'm going to give a full update Monday or Tuesday when I complete week 5.

 

[mhtyler]

Can I ask you what "normal eating" means for you? The only reason I ask is that that is a really important part of the whole process.

That is a very pointed question. In his book, Prof Taylor's advice for normal eating is, "3/4's of what you used to eat." He means we should eat less of course, and certainly we should eat healthier; so far so good. However, I believe that any successful long-term eating plan must include eating to satiety.

I accept the low-calorie diet I'm on as a temporary measure, and I like the idea that if things get out of hand I can always re-implement it in the short term. Nevertheless, I must have an eating plan that allows nutrition, satiety. and enjoyment. I also intend to resume a high level of activity after I reach my weight goal which includes resistance training and aerobics.

So, protein will be first, then fat, and carbs last. I'm hoping that I'll be able to eventually sustain 100 carbs a day or a bit more. A healthy liver can absorb about that much, but even in remission the, "blue touch paper" that set off my T2D in the first place is heightened skeletal muscle insulin resistance...okay, and crisps and donuts... (the former of which is not fixed by weight loss). That's why daily aerobics and resistance training is key. So in short, my genius plan is to eat right and exercise regularly. My advice to anyone is to shop around the edges of the Supermarket not in the center where most of the processed food is, and I know Tesco is much the same as my local Publix (I'm in South Carolina) in that regard.

 

[Lucyr]

I'm concerned that my loss rate has so deteriorated that 8 weeks won't be nearly enough to reach my goal of 35 pounds

8 weeks is nowhere near long enough for 35 pounds to be a realistic goal. You might lose 4-5lbs a week in the early stages yes, but it’s unrealistic to expect that to continue for 8 weeks.

 

[mhtyler]

Congratulations on your fantastic weight loss so far and great readings. Hope you break through the plateau next week.

As said, 6.1 is not in any way a spike and whilst it may seem pedantic to make an issue of that, some people on the forum, particularly newbies, get really anxious about what a spike is and if they read that 6.1 is a spike and it goes unchallenged they may become a lot more anxious. 6.1 is marginally more elevated than your normal waking readings but within the error range of the instrument you are using to measure.
Whilst there is no specific definition of a spike in the context of diabetes and BG levels, it is generally a hard, sharply pointed item and unless you have a graph with very odd axes, the difference between 5.6 and 6.1 is, in my opinion, a molehill that you could comfortably sit on and squash rather than anything which would cause a pain in the backside. 🙄

I was 5.5 this AM, so I'm feeling a bit more philosophical on the issue ;-)

 

[mhtyler]

8 weeks is nowhere near long enough for 35 pounds to be a realistic goal. You might lose 4-5lbs a week in the early stages yes, but it’s unrealistic to expect that to continue for 8 weeks.

In his Counterbalance study, all of Prof Taylor's subjects seemed to have reached their goal (33lbs) at 8 weeks on the VLCD diet. I'm down 18 today at the one-month mark with 17 to go. Maybe it's because, at 69, I'm older than the average person in the study. My adherence is as perfect as I know how to make it. I'll stick with it to find out how long it will take. My Wife can't believe I've lasted on it this long. No choice. Must jettison T2D.

 

[Drummer]

If there is only chocolate and vanilla perhaps be a bit creative and add some orange or peppermint oil to the chocolate, I'd be tempted to add a teaspoon of rum for an evening drink. You don't have to become a monk to lose weight - actually monks do enjoy a drink, now I think about it.
Anyway - vanilla - well that's a blank canvas for just about any flavour. I had access to all sorts when working for allied lyons, I wonder if maple and walnut would still be an potion - but if you find the zero sugar flavours in your local supermarket there should be plenty of options

 

[mhtyler]

If there is only chocolate and vanilla perhaps be a bit creative and add some orange or peppermint oil to the chocolate, I'd be tempted to add a teaspoon of rum for an evening drink. You don't have to become a monk to lose weight - actually monks do enjoy a drink, now I think about it.
Anyway - vanilla - well that's a blank canvas for just about any flavour. I had access to all sorts when working for allied lyons, I wonder if maple and walnut would still be an potion - but if you find the zero sugar flavours in your local supermarket there should be plenty of options

Actually, I do have that ability. I've got all kinds of extracts I can add to the vanilla. Pumpkin Spice works best, but usually I don't bother. I do have one other flavor from another brand that is plant based. It's strawberry, and it's okay, but a bit chalky. There are so many different brands, you could go broke trying all of them. The last couple of days I've found some pretty good packaged soups that fit the bill. I had a cup of cream of chicken soup yesterday...really good, and it's so nice to have a savory flavor for a change. As a side note, I was watching a video on YouTube by Dr Mariela Glandt who in referring to Prof. Taylor's 800 cal diet called it, "carby". She has a point. 3 Optifasts by themselves are about 54kcals. That's fairly low carb, but not quite keto, and many people need to take their carbs to about 25 or so before their numbers are normal. My average carbs is around 30 on the U.S. substitutes I'm using. Does that matter? Who knows.

 

[AndBreathe]

That is a very pointed question. In his book, Prof Taylor's advice for normal eating is, "3/4's of what you used to eat." He means we should eat less of course, and certainly we should eat healthier; so far so good. However, I believe that any successful long-term eating plan must include eating to satiety.

I accept the low-calorie diet I'm on as a temporary measure, and I like the idea that if things get out of hand I can always re-implement it in the short term. Nevertheless, I must have an eating plan that allows nutrition, satiety. and enjoyment. I also intend to resume a high level of activity after I reach my weight goal which includes resistance training and aerobics.

So, protein will be first, then fat, and carbs last. I'm hoping that I'll be able to eventually sustain 100 carbs a day or a bit more. A healthy liver can absorb about that much, but even in remission the, "blue touch paper" that set off my T2D in the first place is heightened skeletal muscle insulin resistance...okay, and crisps and donuts... (the former of which is not fixed by weight loss). That's why daily aerobics and resistance training is key. So in short, my genius plan is to eat right and exercise regularly. My advice to anyone is to shop around the edges of the Supermarket not in the center where most of the processed food is, and I know Tesco is much the same as my local Publix (I'm in South Carolina) in that regard.

The question wasn’t pointed, it was asked in the hope you had considered it, or that it would trigger some thought.

Unfortunately, over the years, I have seen many count down to the end of the ND, planning which treat will be on the menu. For some, the ND is a bit of a revolving door.

To be clear, the ND wasn’t my choice of approach at diagnosis, but it is an option on the table for anyone who feels it will suit them. One size does not fit all.

 

[mhtyler]

The question wasn’t pointed, it was asked in the hope you had considered it, or that it would trigger some thought.

Unfortunately, over the years, I have seen many count down to the end of the ND, planning which treat will be on the menu. For some, the ND is a bit of a revolving door.

To be clear, the ND wasn’t my choice of approach at diagnosis, but it is an option on the table for anyone who feels it will suit them. One size does not fit all.

I don't know what you mean by pointed. I meant that it was a good point.

 

[silentsquirrel]

I don't know what you mean by pointed. I meant that it was a good point.

Language problem, perhaps? "A pointed question" has a somewhat negative connotation in the UK, perhaps not in the States. It never means that it was a good point. Best not to assume we speak the same language! 🙂

 

[mhtyler]

Language problem, perhaps? "A pointed question" has a somewhat negative connotation in the UK, perhaps not in the States. It never means that it was a good point. Best not to assume we speak the same language! 🙂

I'll try to steer clear of idioms.

 

[AndBreathe]

Language problem, perhaps? "A pointed question" has a somewhat negative connotation in the UK, perhaps not in the States. It never means that it was a good point. Best not to assume we speak the same language! 🙂

Good explanation. Thanks!