Diet/insulin

[Jamie M]

Hi all,I was diagnosed back in March with type 2 and have been working hard to get my
bs on an even keel.Theres one or two questions I would like to ask with regards to diet
and insulin dosage.I have been eating low fat yogurt along with granola but is there a difference between this and Greek style yogurt.Also I test twice a day once before breakfast and again before my evening meal.My bloods are generally between 5 and 9 so I thought I was managing them pretty well.In the morning I take 9 units of insulin and the evening I take 15 units this keeps me quite steady.I run in the morning after breakfast so I think this helps the evening count but with taking 15 units I’m worried this is a large amount to take.I would be grateful for some advice on anything I’ve mentioned.

 

[trophywench]

You are aiming for between 4 and 7.8, with any meal not increasing your BG tested 2 hrs after the first bite, by more than 3.

The difference between low fat anything and full fat, is firstly that many manufacturers add something consisting of carb to make the thing palatable so you have to always check the carb content and also that low fat yoghurt will mean the carbs in the granola will hit your bloodstream as glucose, quicker. If you want to slow down the absorption of those carbs (any time of day) then add some fat to them!

If your body requires 9u or15u of insulin or 65u, in order to keep your BG at the right level constantly (not just before or after meals) then that's what it needs. How often do you test eg in the middle of the night or other odd times?

 

[SB2015]

Hi @Jamie M

With Diabetes there is no one size fits all, so we each need the insulin we need. I also find that my needs change regularly and that I am forever altering these, but that may be more of a T1 thing.

You mention testing twice a day. Another approach you might want to try is to check before meals and again two hours after. This along with a record of the amount of carbs you are eating will give you info about how your body is coping. This can then help you to make changes to your meals/ portion sizes and/ or exercise levels.

Once you have a clearer idea of what is happening during the day, and how your body reacts to certain foods some are able to reduce their testing.

I hope that helps. Come back with any questions as there is plenty of practical help available on here.

 

[ianf0ster]

Hi Jaime.
The type of greek style yogurt generally mentioned in these threads is the plain full Fat Greek style Yogurt i.e. the more solid one.
The full fat versions with no added flavours tend to have the lowest carb content and carbs = sugar when digested.
Fats consumed as part of a meal can also slow down the absorption of carbs- thus making the Blood Glucose profile less spiky.

Is there some other reason (apart from taking Insulin) that you need to eat low fat and carb heavy foods?

 

[Jamie M]

You are aiming for between 4 and 7.8, with any meal not increasing your BG tested 2 hrs after the first bite, by more than 3.

The difference between low fat anything and full fat, is firstly that many manufacturers add something consisting of carb to make the thing palatable so you have to always check the carb content and also that low fat yoghurt will mean the carbs in the granola will hit your bloodstream as glucose, quicker. If you want to slow down the absorption of those carbs (any time of day) then add some fat to them!

If your body requires 9u or15u of insulin or 65u, in order to keep your BG at the right level constantly (not just before or after meals) then that's what it needs. How often do you test eg in the middle of the night or other odd times?

I only test twice a day before breakfast and before evening meal.The diabetic nurse told me anywhere between 5 and 9 was ok.

 

[Jamie M]

Hi Jaime.
The type of greek style yogurt generally mentioned in these threads is the plain full Fat Greek style Yogurt i.e. the more solid one.
The full fat versions with no added flavours tend to have the lowest carb content and carbs = sugar when digested.
Fats consumed as part of a meal can also slow down the absorption of carbs- thus making the Blood Glucose profile less spiky.

Is there some other reason (apart from taking Insulin) that you need to eat low fat and carb heavy foods?

No reason I went with the recommendations of the diabetes nurse.

 

[Jamie M]

The problem I have is counting carbs plus I’m not really sure how many carbs I should be aiming at.

 

[Vonny]

Hi Jamie M, I'm new to this forum and have had some really excellent pointers on how to go about things. One useful tip was to take a BS test before a meal and again 2 hours after, as SB2015 states above. As I now eat zero refined carbs, it normally only goes up from, say, 5.7 to 6.7, but on Friday I decided to share a pizza with my partner, after which it rocketed to 11.7! This confirmed I am unable to process such carbs, so I'm back to eating complex carbs found in nuts, vegetables etc. A lot of people on this forum seem to eat Burgen, so I am going to buy a loaf and treat myself to a slice of toast now and again. I will continue to test before and 2 hours after eating it to see if it suits me. Best of luck x

 

[Drummer]

What you are doing is not what most ordinary type twos do to get control.
We cut out the carbohydrate and test BS after meals, adjusting the carbs until we get normal numbers. Doing that seems to mean we don't require medication, though some chose to take Metformin - some of us would rather eat frogspawn - but as the plain ordinary type two simply can't process any great amount of carbs in a day, that is how we manage.

 

[DaveB]

Hi. T2 and insulin often don't go well together as many T2s have excess weight with insulin resistance and adding insulin then is not a good idea. You diet isn't right for a T2 (or even T1). Granola can be the worst form of cereal as it uses sugar/honey etc a glue i.e. high carbs. Any yogurt should not be low-fat but natural. So try to keep your carbs at least below 150g/day. If you are overweight then keeping the carbs right down will work and you may be able to come off the insulin eventually. If you are slim then suspect being T1 in which case ask for the two tests for T1 and you may need to move from twice a day mixed insulin to 4-5 times day Basal/Bolus.

 

[Jamie M]

Hi. T2 and insulin often don't go well together as many T2s have excess weight with insulin resistance and adding insulin then is not a good idea. You diet isn't right for a T2 (or even T1). Granola can be the worst form of cereal as it uses sugar/honey etc a glue i.e. high carbs. Any yogurt should not be low-fat but natural. So try to keep your carbs at least below 150g/day. If you are overweight then keeping the carbs right down will work and you may be able to come off the insulin eventually. If you are slim then suspect being T1 in which case ask for the two tests for T1 and you may need to move from twice a day mixed insulin to 4-5 times day Basal/Bolus.

Hi DaveB,I think I will never be off insulin.The reason I’m diabetic is down to having pancreatic cancer.Most of my pancreas has been removed but the he head was left as I was caught very early .My pancreas is working to some degree but just not enough.My weight is not an issue atm as I am relatively fit and apart from diabetes relatively healthy.I just want guidance to eat the right things.Unfortunately I was diagnosed just as Covid hit so haven’t seen the dietician as yet.Im basically picking up information from this site and others.

 

[DaveB]

Hi DaveB,I think I will never be off insulin.The reason I’m diabetic is down to having pancreatic cancer.Most of my pancreas has been removed but the he head was left as I was caught very early .My pancreas is working to some degree but just not enough.My weight is not an issue atm as I am relatively fit and apart from diabetes relatively healthy.I just want guidance to eat the right things.Unfortunately I was diagnosed just as Covid hit so haven’t seen the dietician as yet.Im basically picking up information from this site and others.

Thanks for the reply and I understand and hope the cancer stays away. be a bit careful with NHS dieticians (or any dieticians) as much of their training appears to be based on folklore or food industry mis-information. Most of us on the forums live with diabetes and our views are based on what works and experience. Carbs sadly are the biggest problem and much of our food is full of them. There aren't really any 'good' carbs as some believe. They are all converted to glucose in the stomach but some do have more fibre which is good in itself and the complex carbs are absorbed more slowly reducing BS spikes. Fats are not the big problem the medics say. The liver is responsible for much of the cholesterol in the blood rather than in the fat we eat. Proteins are fine and so are veg and non-tropical fruit. Obviously as you have had a serious medical condition you must listen to your consultants etc

 

[silentsquirrel]

Hi DaveB,I think I will never be off insulin.The reason I’m diabetic is down to having pancreatic cancer.Most of my pancreas has been removed but the he head was left as I was caught very early .My pancreas is working to some degree but just not enough.My weight is not an issue atm as I am relatively fit and apart from diabetes relatively healthy.I just want guidance to eat the right things.Unfortunately I was diagnosed just as Covid hit so haven’t seen the dietician as yet.Im basically picking up information from this site and others.

Hi Jamie, so with only part of your pancreas you are probably Type 3c, rather than T2! Have a search for 3c on the forum if you haven't heard of 3c before.

Thankfully they are treating you with insulin, but it might be to your advantage to persuade your GP to change your classification from T2 to T1 if the computer cannot cope with 3c as a code - it would make a pump or prescription for a Libre possible if this would help later on, no chance of either with a T2 label.

Which insulin are you using? Twice a day suggests a mixed insulin or possibly just a basal insulin. You might get better control with a basal/bolus system - more injections but much more flexibility.

I am tagging in @eggyg, who has much more knowledge of 3c than I.

 

[grovesy]

Hi Jamie, so with only part of your pancreas you are probably Type 3c, rather than T2! Have a search for 3c on the forum if you haven't heard of 3c before.

Thankfully they are treating you with insulin, but it might be to your advantage to persuade your GP to change your classification from T2 to T1 if the computer cannot cope with 3c as a code - it would make a pump or prescription for a Libre possible if this would help later on, no chance of either with a T2 label.

Which insulin are you using? Twice a day suggests a mixed insulin or possibly just a basal insulin. You might get better control with a basal/bolus system - more injections but much more flexibility.

I am tagging in @eggyg, who has much more knowledge of 3c than I.

I agree!

 

[eggyg]

Hi Jamie, so with only part of your pancreas you are probably Type 3c, rather than T2! Have a search for 3c on the forum if you haven't heard of 3c before.

Thankfully they are treating you with insulin, but it might be to your advantage to persuade your GP to change your classification from T2 to T1 if the computer cannot cope with 3c as a code - it would make a pump or prescription for a Libre possible if this would help later on, no chance of either with a T2 label.

Which insulin are you using? Twice a day suggests a mixed insulin or possibly just a basal insulin. You might get better control with a basal/bolus system - more injections but much more flexibility.

I am tagging in @eggyg, who has much more knowledge of 3c than I.

Thanks for the tag, Jamie and I have had a conversation on the newbie thread re Type 3c. 🙂

 

[eggyg]

I agree with @silentsquirrel re mixed insulin. I was started on that but I realised that a MDI ( multiple daily injections) regime would be better as you have more flexibility in your food choices. The nurse/ dietician won’t know what has hit them when you go armed with all this information! Good luck.

 

[trophywench]

I was going to say that - forum spotted Jamie's 'Type' pdq and rediagnosed him earlier on. @Jamie M might help -well it would help! - if you changed you 'type' in your forum Profile, please.

 

[silentsquirrel]

Thanks for the tag, Jamie and I have had a conversation on the newbie thread re Type 3c. 🙂

Ah, missed that - or just forgotten, maybe!

 

[Jamie M]

Hi Jamie, so with only part of your pancreas you are probably Type 3c, rather than T2! Have a search for 3c on the forum if you haven't heard of 3c before.

Thankfully they are treating you with insulin, but it might be to your advantage to persuade your GP to change your classification from T2 to T1 if the computer cannot cope with 3c as a code - it would make a pump or prescription for a Libre possible if this would help later on, no chance of either with a T2 label.

Which insulin are you using? Twice a day suggests a mixed insulin or possibly just a basal insulin. You might get better control with a basal/bolus system - more injections but much more flexibility.

I am tagging in @eggyg, who has much more knowledge of 3c than I.

Thanks for the reply,I’m on humulin 3 ,spoke with the diabetic nurse today .I felt she basically fobbed me of when I told her the feedback I’d had here on the site .She told me I would get the same treatment wether I was type 2 or type 3c.Dont really know where to go with it now.

 

[silentsquirrel]

Thanks for the reply,I’m on humulin 3 ,spoke with the diabetic nurse today .I felt she basically fobbed me of when I told her the feedback I’d had here on the site .She told me I would get the same treatment wether I was type 2 or type 3c.Dont really know where to go with it now.

Not true if you might want a pump or Libre.
I assume this is a nurse at your GP practice? It might be worth pushing your GP to refer you to a hospital Diabetic clinic.