Diabetes and Dialysis

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Admiral Benbow

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At risk of diabetes
Does anyone know any statistics on people with diabetes having to go on dialysis? What are the odds of this complication?
 
I do not know the 9dds but bear in mind 8t will be based on historical data. As a result, I expect it is less now as diabetes management has improved with things like finger prick meters and more recently CGMs. On addition, for those taking insulin, the options have improved.
 
Diabetes is a risk factor for CKD but according to the National Kidney Federation less that 1 in 10 people with CKD will end up needing dialysis.

www.kidney.org.uk

Chronic kidney disease

Kidney disease is a term used by doctors to include any abnormality of the kidneys, even if there is only very slight damage.
www.kidney.org.uk www.kidney.org.uk
 
Admiral Benbow said:
Does anyone know any statistics on people with diabetes having to go on dialysis? What are the odds of this complication?
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Is there any particular reason you’re asking? Have you had some bad kidney function results and looking to reduce the risk?
 
I think it is also worth remembering that not everyone with poor kidney function needing dialysis will be living with diabetes. Just like eye disease, heart disease and neuropathy, diabetes in just one cause.

Frankly, my approach is to try to stay as health as I can; keeping my bloods in decent shape, minding my blood pressure and keeping my fluids up.
 
AndBreathe said:
Frankly, my approach is to try to stay as healthy as I can; keeping my bloods in decent shape, minding my blood pressure and keeping my fluids up.
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Me too, plus not overdoing salt, protein and (with one eye on cholesterol levels) saturated fat.
 
Lucyr said:
Is there any particular reason you’re asking? Have you had some bad kidney function results and looking to reduce the risk?
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Just watched a video about dialysis and it scared me. I wonder about the odds of having to go on dialysis if diagnosed with diabetes.
 
And here's me, had diabetes for 52 years so far and regularly having my kidney function tested (eGFR blood test) along with all the other things tested annually, and never any sign of kidney probs - and there's you haven't even got diabetes, panicking about summat that does sometimes happen, but absolutely not very likely for most of us.

Keep hydrated, lose any excess weight you need to, keep your blood pressure in the normal range, and take enough exercise - our son in law has Stage 4 CKD (- own fault, not keeping well enough hydrated for a couple of decades (daughter was forever telling him about it) and landed up in hospital when the pain of try to pass a kidney stone caused him to pass out at work, who called an ambulance) - and that's what he's told to do, not needed anything else cos he's done what he was told and it's keeping him OK so far.
 
trophywench said:
And here's me, had diabetes for 52 years so far and regularly having my kidney function tested (eGFR blood test) along with all the other things tested annually, and never any sign of kidney probs - and there's you haven't even got diabetes, panicking about summat that does sometimes happen, but absolutely not very likely for most of us.

Keep hydrated, lose any excess weight you need to, keep your blood pressure in the normal range, and take enough exercise - our son in law has Stage 4 CKD (- own fault, not keeping well enough hydrated for a couple of decades (daughter was forever telling him about it) and landed up in hospital when the pain of try to pass a kidney stone caused him to pass out at work, who called an ambulance) - and that's what he's told to do, not needed anything else cos he's done what he was told and it's keeping him OK so far.
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That's true, I am becoming something of a hypochondriac. I wonder if this is because I am in my 40s now, and seeing more and more people I knew passing on, or just coming to terms that the clock is ticking downward. Midlife crisis perhaps?
 
Admiral Benbow said:
Does anyone know any statistics on people with diabetes having to go on dialysis? What are the odds of this complication?
Click to expand...

https://www.kidneyresearchuk.org/re...research-uk-and-diabetes-uk-joint-statement/#

“Lives are lost because of kidney disease. It accounts for 21% of deaths in Type 1 diabetes, and 11% of deaths in Type 2 diabetes [1].
It has a huge impact on quality of life. Diabetes is the single most common cause of end-stage kidney disease in the UK [2]. For new patients needing dialysis or a transplant, 27.5% of cases are a result of diabetic kidney disease [2]. Right now, people in this position are faced with the options of dialysis or transplant (known as renal replacement therapies).
The numbers are rising. More people with diabetes are developing kidney disease. Right now, there are 22,600 people in the UK who have diabetes and need dialysis or a kidney transplant [3]. At least 9,900 people have end-stage kidney failure because of damage directly caused by their diabetes [2].”
 
Published 2018.

Meanwhile of course - every c.45minutes, worldwide, men are dying from prostate cancer - primarily because none of them get any lifelong cancer screening tests, so it isn't diagnosed until it's usually too late to treat it properly and prevent it becoming life threatening. Shedloads of those that do escape it - where post mortems have to be done for whatever reason, are found to have it, although it wasn't that, which killed them.

If you worry about ALL the things that might kill you - you'll worry yourself to death!
 
trophywench said:
Shedloads of those that do escape it - where post mortems have to be done for whatever reason, are found to have it, although it wasn't that, which killed them.
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Which is the problem with screening: sometimes it tells you something you'd be better off not knowing. (Whether that's true for a particular proposed screening regime depends on the details but screening isn't invariably beneficial.)
 
I've just had a conversation with my elderly mother's GP. Mum has been T2 for 40 years. GP told me mum's kidney function is very poor - she's on the verge of needing to be referred for dialysis. A lot is due, according to GP, because mum is not controlling her diabetes (& not drinking enough). Everyday mum is snacking on sweet biscuits & chocolate, has pudding after every meal, and eats quantities of fruit - think nectarine, banana, grapes & raisins in one sitting. She's also having bread & jam as a "snack" before bed.

She has capability and understands the consequences of her actions, so I'm at a loss at what to do with her.
 
DancingStar said:
I've just had a conversation with my elderly mother's GP. Mum has been T2 for 40 years. GP told me mum's kidney function is very poor - she's on the verge of needing to be referred for dialysis. A lot is due, according to GP, because mum is not controlling her diabetes (& not drinking enough). Everyday mum is snacking on sweet biscuits & chocolate, has pudding after every meal, and eats quantities of fruit - think nectarine, banana, grapes & raisins in one sitting. She's also having bread & jam as a "snack" before bed.

She has capability and understands the consequences of her actions, so I'm at a loss at what to do with her.
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How old is she, and what are some of her stats? For example, most recent A1C, Fasting Glucose, Trigs, height, weight, Creatinine levels? Do you know any of those numbers?
 
Without sounding patronising @DancingStar are you sure she fully understands? Sometimes I find people (of all ages) kind of switch their brain off when they’re told bad things that they know. They hear the beginning of the sentence and fill in the rest in their head without listening to what the person is saying at that moment. Thus, if a situation has got worse, they don’t really hear it. Their brain just fills in “yes, yes, I know this. It’s not good - yes, I know”.
 
She's 89. Her last Hba1c - earlier this week - was 79. I'm not sure what the kidney function test measured, just that it was "39". I would say she's just under 5 foot tall - no idea about her weight, not thin and skinny but not overweight either.

If I try & say anything she'll just raise her voice and tell me she's been diabetic for 40 years and doesn't need my advice.

On the one hand I feel like saying "well just get on with it then and you'll reap the consequences". On the other hand I care about her very much and I don't want to her to be ill & suffering.
 
That must be hard. I can’t give advice because it depends on the individual and how they’ll respond, but for my mum I’d try being matter of fact “So, how will you be getting to the hospital for your dialysis?” in a friendly, matter of fact way. Coming at it from a ‘side angle’ like that can make the person stop and think. You could also try writing it down in a simple sentence or two, or delivering the sentences verbally just as you’re leaving, so that you can get things out quickly.

You could also ask her GP or nurse to phone her and put things kindly but bluntly. I know it’s hard as people get older. All you can do is your best xx
 
DancingStar said:
She's 89. Her last Hba1c - earlier this week - was 79. I'm not sure what the kidney function test measured, just that it was "39". I would say she's just under 5 foot tall - no idea about her weight, not thin and skinny but not overweight either.

If I try & say anything she'll just raise her voice and tell me she's been diabetic for 40 years and doesn't need my advice.

On the one hand I feel like saying "well just get on with it then and you'll reap the consequences". On the other hand I care about her very much and I don't want to her to be ill & suffering.
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Well, at 89 she certainly has lived a long life. That's impressive diabetic or not. If that 39 was the eGFR, then she is probably having kidney disease but not kidney failure which is at 15. So from what I understand she might be at stage 3b of CKD? But then again she's 89. Dr. Google says a female 89-year-old has a 5.23-year life expectancy at that point (not for just diabetics but every female). Probably best for her to try some diet control, but at 89 maybe she is willing to risk the consequences.
 
Thank you for your input. I was panicking after the GP phone call but talking her has put things in perspective a bit.
 
Talking here, I meant to write.
 
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