Daily menu suggestions?

[Ghost Hunter]

Hi

I have dug out the 'portion guide' which I was issued with when I attended a Food for thought course earlier this year. It is specific to me as the dietician calculated it using my information. It was a general healthy eating course via the NHS so no specific information of diet and type 2 diabetes was given to me.

What I would like to do is to have some suggestions for Breakfast, Lunch and dinner so I can make up my own weekly menues.

The info I was given is:

Total daily allowances - 1200 Kcals per day.

Fat allowance 25g low fat spread or 12g butter or margarine. (I like to use Flora Pro Active Olive.)

Food group Daily portions allowed

Starchy 5

Fruit &
Vegetables 5

Milk &
Dairy 3

Meat, fish
& alternatives 2

Daily extras allowed (treats) 3 per week.


Any suggestions or ideas would help please as im not much of a 'recipie cook' so the quicker and simpler the better please 😱

Thanks 🙂

 

[Caroline]

Does sound a bit general. Must admit if I have to plan ahead, by the time I get to lunch I don't usually want what I had prepared and end up buying something anyway.

Have you tried a google search for a menu planner? Lots of the slimming sites do them, and I think some of the supermarket sites might do them as well.

 

[VBH]

It was a general healthy eating course via the NHS so no specific information of diet and type 2 diabetes was given to me.

So its not been customised for diabetics at all then. So there's no allowance built into it for the fact that you cannot tolerate a lot of carbs without your BG going through the roof.

The first fact that every diabetic should be aware of is: Carbs raise BG.
Here's a quick second: Fat slows down carbs.

So this diet appears to be aimed at lots of "healthy" carbs and no fat. So its pretty much guaranteed to raise your BG.

Like many diet recommendations from the NHS, DUK etc it makes no allowance for BG and is aimed at weight control and the misnomer that fat is evil.

There is a long-received wisdom that eating fat raises cholesterol, which ignores the fact that a lot of cholesterol is manufactured by the body, particularly triglicerides. When Atkins became popular there was a sudden rush of research which set out to prove that it would be deadly because it would shoot everyone's cholesterol through the roof.

The researchers were a little disappointed. Cholesterol went down.

Fat is only really a problem in the presence of a lot of carbohydrates.

So this dietary advice, although common, is aimed at the wrong targets. Firstly it does not allow for the effects of a lot of carbs on the BG for a T2. And second its based on fat-phobia and its effects on cholesterol, while ensuring that the conditions for raised cholesterol are present.

What you might find to be far more effective is eating in such a way that your BG stays under control. Many people find that by controlling their BG fairly well also leads to weight control as a side effect.

More on this to follow in the Rosemary Conley thread.

 

[Ghost Hunter]

So its not been customised for diabetics at all then. So there's no allowance built into it for the fact that you cannot tolerate a lot of carbs without your BG going through the roof.

The first fact that every diabetic should be aware of is: Carbs raise BG.
Here's a quick second: Fat slows down carbs.

So this diet appears to be aimed at lots of "healthy" carbs and no fat. So its pretty much guaranteed to raise your BG.

Like many diet recommendations from the NHS, DUK etc it makes no allowance for BG and is aimed at weight control and the misnomer that fat is evil.

There is a long-received wisdom that eating fat raises cholesterol, which ignores the fact that a lot of cholesterol is manufactured by the body, particularly triglicerides. When Atkins became popular there was a sudden rush of research which set out to prove that it would be deadly because it would shoot everyone's cholesterol through the roof.

The researchers were a little disappointed. Cholesterol went down.

Fat is only really a problem in the presence of a lot of carbohydrates.

So this dietary advice, although common, is aimed at the wrong targets. Firstly it does not allow for the effects of a lot of carbs on the BG for a T2. And second its based on fat-phobia and its effects on cholesterol, while ensuring that the conditions for raised cholesterol are present.

What you might find to be far more effective is eating in such a way that your BG stays under control. Many people find that by controlling their BG fairly well also leads to weight control as a side effect.

More on this to follow in the Rosemary Conley thread.

Hi thanks for the reply. As you might be aware I have been told by GP / nurse that it is not necessary for me to 'test' myself with a meter so no idea what efects BG has on me. That might have been fine for the first year whilst I was on 'diet & lifestyle' change only but now I am on Medication (Metformin SR) I feel I should be more aware of whats going on inside. I have recently been to see my GP and requested with a fight that I be allowed to test so I obviously have a lot to learn still. However I am looking foward to gaining self control and fingers crossed lose weight as well.

Does anyone know if there is a more suitable T2 Diabetes tailored 'diet' workshp via the NHS etc?

Thanks

🙂

 

[aymes]

I don't know much of the specifics but enquire about diabetes education courses through your local PCT. I know of one called DESMOND which is aimed at type 2s but I'm sure there are others and some on here may have personal reccomendations.
Good luck in your battle to get started testing regularly, I think it is vital for good control, everyone's tolerance and experience of different foods is so different it's probably the only way of knowing what works for you.

 

[VBH]

There's 2 general types of education for T2s. DESMOND and XPERT. From what I understand of them, DESMOND is the weaker of the two and pushes the high carb low fat dietary advice including lots of carbs for breakfast.

I know someone doing XPERT at the moment and apparently chocolate cake is low GI (!). The information given out at XPERT appears to be very mixed with the usual contradictions in that they know carbs raise BG....but still advise plenty of em. Strange really.

However, NICE guidelines state that strips should be prescribed along with a general educational package. So I would suggest asking about a course regardless.

 

[katie]

...

Like many diet recommendations from the NHS, DUK etc it makes no allowance for BG and is aimed at weight control and the misnomer that fat is evil. ...

The researchers were a little disappointed. Cholesterol went down.

Fat is only really a problem in the presence of a lot of carbohydrates.
...

Hi VBH,

I know there are a couple of people who have claimed this on here. I was just wondering why doctors still tell cardiac patients to avoid saturated fats etc? Dodger for one has claimed they aren't the enemy.

Do doctors/scientists say fat is only a problem in the presence of lots of carbs? did they publish the fact that cholestorol went down?

Do you have any official sources?

 

[VBH]

Where do I start? There are shedloads of studies demonstrating improving cholesterol when carbs are reduced. Mostly these are in relation to weight loss.

Conversely its very difficult to find a study where cholesterol gets worse when carbs are reduced.

So for starters, hows about this as a summary, which has 3 links to research studies indicating lipid profile improvement:
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/faq/f/carbcholesterol.htm

For anyone not wanting to get too technical and into reading dull research documents, its a good intro. For anyone wanting to get more into it, the three cites at the bottom of the article are a good starting point.

 

[Ghost Hunter]

There's 2 general types of education for T2s. DESMOND and XPERT. From what I understand of them, DESMOND is the weaker of the two and pushes the high carb low fat dietary advice including lots of carbs for breakfast.

I know someone doing XPERT at the moment and apparently chocolate cake is low GI (!). The information given out at XPERT appears to be very mixed with the usual contradictions in that they know carbs raise BG....but still advise plenty of em. Strange really.

However, NICE guidelines state that strips should be prescribed along with a general educational package. So I would suggest asking about a course regardless.

Hi thanks for that info, I have already been on the DESMOND, but personally didnt get a lot out of it, have just re-read the booklets we were given at the course and they dont really tell me much I dont already know anyway.

Is there anywhere I can find out more info on the XPERT programme (and any others) so when I do eventually get to start on a meter I can ask for a placement?

Also would it be worth me mentioning the low carb diet or will it be a rude word? 🙄

Many thanks

 

[insulinaddict09]

Where do I start? There are shedloads of studies demonstrating improving cholesterol when carbs are reduced. Mostly these are in relation to weight loss.

Conversely its very difficult to find a study where cholesterol gets worse when carbs are reduced.

So for starters, hows about this as a summary, which has 3 links to research studies indicating lipid profile improvement:
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/faq/f/carbcholesterol.htm

For anyone not wanting to get too technical and into reading dull research documents, its a good intro. For anyone wanting to get more into it, the three cites at the bottom of the article are a good starting point.

Thanks for posting this !!! as a side point , my cholesterol has dropped since ive been a restricted carber !!

 

[VBH]

Is there anywhere I can find out more info on the XPERT programme (and any others) so when I do eventually get to start on a meter I can ask for a placement?

Depends on your PCT and I think if they are doing DESMOND, they are unlikely to be doing XPERT. XPERT doesn't involve using a meter either.

As for a meter - I suggest you buy one in the short term and sort out the strips prescription later when you can. My local Asda has an in-store pharmacy. A couple of weeks ago it had a choice of two for ?4 each. A larger sainsburys a bit further away also has an in-store pharmacy with another meter for ?4. The likes of boots, lloyds pharmacies have em starting at a tenner.

Never buy strips from a pharmacy since they will cost about ?25. From the manufacturer direct they are about ?17. From ebay (watch out for expiry dates) they are usually about ?13 including p&p.

Also would it be worth me mentioning the low carb diet or will it be a rude word? 🙄

That's like walking in and saying "I am a satanist" Or if you are american "I am a liberal" 😉

Its taken years for the ADA (american diabetes assoc) to grudgingly say something along the lines of 'ok you can low carb for a year to lose weight if you really must'. DUK and the NHS generally recoil in terror at the suggestion 😱

If you're going to mention it, I suggest you outline Jennifer's Advice and state that you intend to use the meter to measure the effects that food and exercise have on your BG levels and learn from that to improve your control.

Apart from being true, it sounds better to docs and doesn't involve any "labels". While that approach generally leads to some form of carb management and in a lot of cases something that amounts to the same thing as "low carb" at the end of the day, its the approach and outlook that sounds less scary 😉

 

[katie]

Yeah thanks for that VBH, I shall take a look 🙂

 

[katie]

That's like walking in and saying "I am a satanist" Or if you are american "I am a liberal" 😉

lol, I went to see my gp a couple of weeks ago and she asked how my levels are. I said they are getting a bit better now because ive reduced the amount of carbs I eat and i'm doing more exercise. She just said "oh that's great!".