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Conflicting advice about carbs and good diabetes management

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This thread is now closed. Please contact Anna DUK, Ieva DUK or everydayupsanddowns if you would like it re-opened.
As you say the advice was conflicting although I found him quite convincing. Because I tend to do as I am told, I have been including some carbs with every meal just as my DN advised and it seems to suit me both in terms of weight loss and blood sugar control. I will be interested in what others think.
Thanks for alerting me to the programme which I had missed.
Linda
 
Salinda said:
As you say the advice was conflicting although I found him quite convincing. Because I tend to do as I am told, I have been including some carbs with every meal just as my DN advised and it seems to suit me both in terms of weight loss and blood sugar control. I will be interested in what others think.
Thanks for alerting me to the programme which I had missed.
Linda
Click to expand...

I think what they both should have been saying is that each individual needs to find out what works best for them i.e. a healthy, sustainable diet that has a good effect on their blood sugar levels, and with the amount of medication they are willing to take to help achieve that. If I remember rightly, no actual suggestion was made as to what 'low carb' actually meant in terms of quantity - the Dr. gave the impression that no carbs were good, and the DUK lady argued that they are essential :confused:

Although I am on insulin and can 'cover' any carbs I have, I am still careful not to overload myself with a high carb meal because that is where I begin to lose tight control over matching insulin to carbs at higher doses. I didn't really think the argument of risking hypos if you didn't eat enough carbs was valid - if it was me I'd simply inject less insulin.
 
Weren't impressed..

Briffra I have no respect for at all.

Wonder which Study Briffra was talking about, as if it was the Exeter study, the idea of a 'low carb' diet wasn't his idea of a 'low carb diet' but I got the feeling that it is more than likely one of the very iffy biased studies that frequent a not heard of back water medical journey...


The Hum DUK women was just as bad, with a serious lack of expanding of 'some' and didn't even ask Briffra what study he was using for reference...

So conclusion, a somewhat waste of air time.
 
If you read it from here you can see the studies that he cited.
http://www.drbriffa.com/2012/03/05/...y-advice-diabetes-uk-dishes-out-to-diabetics/

DUK say that they follow the NHS advice that is evidence based. I can only speak as a Type2 and would say that if all newly diagnosed had some education which included how to use a meter to understand the foods that you eat and how they affect glucose levels it would be a lot easier. It doesn't have to be high/medium/low carb but has to be something that suits you personally and helps you to manage diabetes. There are so many versions of what actually constitutes a low carb diet. Some believe you have to follow Atkins and others that you reduce the RDA of carbs. I believe that you eat to your meter.

As neither Briffa or the Dietitian on the programme are diabetics, that is the problem IMHO. They think they know what is best and that one size should fit all but it doesn't. Neither of them impressed me. He took control but was very cagey about his evidence and the Dietitian was ill prepared and hopelessly backward in coming forward.

It will not change the way I manage my diabetes.
 
Evidence?

cherrypie said:
If you read it from here you can see the studies that he cited.
http://www.drbriffa.com/2012/03/05/...y-advice-diabetes-uk-dishes-out-to-diabetics/

DUK say that they follow the NHS advice that is evidence based. I can only speak as a Type2 and would say that if all newly diagnosed had some education which included how to use a meter to understand the foods that you eat and how they affect glucose levels it would be a lot easier. It doesn't have to be high/medium/low carb but has to be something that suits you personally and helps you to manage diabetes. There are so many versions of what actually constitutes a low carb diet. Some believe you have to follow Atkins and others that you reduce the RDA of carbs. I believe that you eat to your meter.

As neither Briffa or the Dietitian on the programme are diabetics, that is the problem IMHO. They think they know what is best and that one size should fit all but it doesn't. Neither of them impressed me. He took control but was very cagey about his evidence and the Dietitian was ill prepared and hopelessly backward in coming forward.

It will not change the way I manage my diabetes.
Click to expand...

I would love to know what the NHS evidence is for having carbs with every meal etc. I've never seen any evidence quoted for this stance only a rather daft quote in a document on the NHS Diabetes website saying that low-carb diets may be harmful therefore not recommended. I'd rather take the risk of possible but unlikely harm than have the typical western diet that is know to be harmful through obesity.
 
I wonder if she actually clocked what he was saying when he asked, 'What's wrong with ketosis?' - cos the answer is nowt, if you are trying to lose weight, anyway!

It's not the same as keto-acidosis and she sounded a bit confused.

Not a good showing for DUK - very weak. You'd hope they'd know better than to put someone who couldn't give properly researched and cited, educated, snappy answers to someone with Dr B's track-record foward to debate with him, wouldn't you!

Just because it's the NHS stance does NOT make it the right one .....
 
Keys had some input, but main research used is main stream and research they've commissioned themselves

I don't go for extreme low carb diet's as a main stream way of controlling diabetes, in many cases it's not needed what is needed is for the diabetic to reduce carb intake to moderate levels, and chose wisely... And cooking fresh foods from scratch also helps out a lot..

The only problem with the western diet, is that it's a combination of fats and carbohydrates and people inability to eat it with wisdom and knowledge. And adjusting life styles and mindsets is pretty difficult...
 
A problem which can occur with low carb diets is that carbs are replaced with fat and/or protein, just to get enough calories/volume of food. There is real evidence that high fat diets cause illness, and high protein diets can put an extra burden on kidneys (not to mention ecological pressure!)

But I think the key point has been made, individuals need to find what works for them - that's also real evidence. Time someone did some trials with real people!
 
If my memory serves me right, the Israelis tried to do a extreme low carb diet over a 2 year period but it failed as precipitants pulled out of the trial... So unable to collect enough usable data to make a conclusion.

And that is the main problem with diets that cut out a complete food group it takes one hell of a motivated person to follow them for any length of time and how effective are they in the long run, if you check out Jimmy Moore blog you find out that he's been promoting the benefits of following a extreme low diet for 8 years+. yes he's lost a lot of weight but is still very obese and he's weight has fluctuated over the years so he's trying the Palo diet now!

So I think I stick to the diet I've got, it includes all foods I've no complications and excellent control after 23 years of being diabetic I must be getting something right...
 
Ellie Jones said:
Weren't impressed..

Briffra I have no respect for at all.

Wonder which Study Briffra was talking about, as if it was the Exeter study, the idea of a 'low carb' diet wasn't his idea of a 'low carb diet' but I got the feeling that it is more than likely one of the very iffy biased studies that frequent a not heard of back water medical journey...


The Hum DUK women was just as bad, with a serious lack of expanding of 'some' and didn't even ask Briffra what study he was using for reference...

So conclusion, a somewhat waste of air time.
Click to expand...

I agree, a case of he said, she said for total confusion to reign!
 
Ellie Jones said:
So I think I stick to the diet I've got, it includes all foods I've no complications and excellent control after 23 years of being diabetic I must be getting something right...
Click to expand...

From what you've said on other threads about carbs Ellie I think you are following a low or at least moderate carb diet by many people's measuring sticks.

300g a day? No thanks! Not for me.

NHS 'eatwell plate' based on the 'food pyramid' developed by the USDA (that's US Department of Agriculture folks). Hmmmmmm.

What saddens me (as Cherrypie suggests) is that when the question of carbs arises it tends to focus only on the extremes. Yes v low carb will work for some people. Yes some will cope OK with the standard 'lots of carbs' NHS advice.

But why do we always have to discount carb reduction/moderation because 'eating no carbs at all is not a very easy and/or wise approach'? Why are people who are denied test strips encouraged to eat plenty of the very thing that will cause their levels to rise to unacceptable levels?
 
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