cholesterol saturated fat question

Status
Not open for further replies.
P

PGW

Well-Known Member
Relationship to Diabetes
Type 2
Had my diabetes review last week and my nurse said my hba1c had dropped from 51 to 44 since March this year which was good (am on Metformin). However she also said that my cholesterol level had gone up since then from 4.8 to 5.2 and prescribed Atorvastatin (40mg per day) to bring it down to below 4 which I believe is the NICE reccomendation for type 2.

I dont have a weight problem as I have lost a bit of weight since carb watching I am now 55.6 kg and dont really want to lose any more (I'm 72)

I'm ok with watching carb content but is there any advice on looking at the saturated fat content per 100g on food nutrition labels to help with cholesterol levels? What to avoid what looks ok?
 
i have exactly the same problem. Cut out all butter and cream and pastry etc but doctor has put me on the same medication. I questioned my doctor on why when I watch my diet and am not overweight and she said it’s just the way it is Unfortunately. Annoyiny.
 
PGW said:
Had my diabetes review last week and my nurse said my hba1c had dropped from 51 to 44 since March this year which was good (am on Metformin). However she also said that my cholesterol level had gone up since then from 4.8 to 5.2 and prescribed Atorvastatin (40mg per day) to bring it down to below 4 which I believe is the NICE reccomendation for type 2.

I dont have a weight problem as I have lost a bit of weight since carb watching I am now 55.6 kg and dont really want to lose any more (I'm 72)

I'm ok with watching carb content but is there any advice on looking at the saturated fat content per 100g on food nutrition labels to help with cholesterol levels? What to avoid what looks ok?
Click to expand...
Well done on the HbA1c drop. Not far off normal and a chance to maybe come off the metformin, so keep going.

The RDA for saturated fat is 30g per day for the average man and 20g per day for the average woman and I try and keep below that. Interestingly, my cholesterol was 5.1 when I had my diabetes diagnosis but my DN didn't think that warranted medication. Nor was medication suggested at my last review when it was 4.4, so not for the first time it seems that there is no consistency in treatment across the NHS. It depends on where you live and who you see.
 
Below 4.0 (serum cholesterol) I believe is the recommended level for T2’s but for ‘normal’ people it’s below 4.5.

Did you get a full breakdown of your serum lipids? If so, it’s your LDL that’s the ‘bad’ one. My nurse wanted this to be under 2.8 and mine is 3.0 so I’m not fretting about it.

No-one can force you to take statins, it’s your body, your decision but you have to weigh up the pros and cons of both.
 
Atorvastatin and Metformin blasted my memory and made my body ache, I become weak and forgetful.
I sing English and Scottish folk songs, but I used to do it from memory, now I am able to recall a fair number once more but the experience has shaken my confidence and without the words, my voice trembles.
I would not take a statin for a pension.
Just 5 weeks of one tablet a day and I lost the car in the supermarket car park and found I had done all the shopping for Christmas 2016 twice.
On the back of the photo which was on the dresser is the information 'your mother is the one on the right'.
I keep coming across claims that there is no advantage being seen in having a low level of cholesterol, and those with above average cholesterol levels actually live longer and keep their cognitive functions at a higher level as well.
My brother in law takes statins because his GP prescribed them, and my sister has been mourning the loss of him for a while. He's still alive, just not the man he used to be.
 
Drummer said:
Atorvastatin and Metformin blasted my memory and made my body ache, I become weak and forgetful.
I sing English and Scottish folk songs, but I used to do it from memory, now I am able to recall a fair number once more but the experience has shaken my confidence and without the words, my voice trembles.
I would not take a statin for a pension.
Just 5 weeks of one tablet a day and I lost the car in the supermarket car park and found I had done all the shopping for Christmas 2016 twice.
On the back of the photo which was on the dresser is the information 'your mother is the one on the right'.
I keep coming across claims that there is no advantage being seen in having a low level of cholesterol, and those with above average cholesterol levels actually live longer and keep their cognitive functions at a higher level as well.
My brother in law takes statins because his GP prescribed them, and my sister has been mourning the loss of him for a while. He's still alive, just not the man he used to be.
Click to expand...
Good grief!!
 
Drummer said:
torvastatin and Metformin blasted my memory and made my body ache, I become weak and forgetful.
Click to expand...
For what it's worth, everey cell in your body, and particularly in your brain, uses cholesterol as it's building blocks. Therefore I am in severe doubt as to whether your brain would indeed perform properly if cholesterol were too low.
 
Ah, the statins debate. I am probably in line for them and after a lot of thought decided to accept them, get the lowest dosage and see what (if anything) gives me problems. My total cholestrol is 6.4 with all levels except trigs normal can't remember trigs one but it was slightly elevated level over the normal marker. My total was 6 4. One nurse said Statins and a second nurse said it was fine. Damn and blast my enthusiastic liver.
 
I got away this time as I said I want to try just one medication as I will know which one is doing me any good. I think the statins do not help with pain. Are GPs on commission if they dish out more of these?
 
PGW said:
Had my diabetes review last week and my nurse said my hba1c had dropped from 51 to 44 since March this year which was good (am on Metformin). However she also said that my cholesterol level had gone up since then from 4.8 to 5.2 and prescribed Atorvastatin (40mg per day) to bring it down to below 4 which I believe is the NICE reccomendation for type 2.

I dont have a weight problem as I have lost a bit of weight since carb watching I am now 55.6 kg and dont really want to lose any more (I'm 72)

I'm ok with watching carb content but is there any advice on looking at the saturated fat content per 100g on food nutrition labels to help with cholesterol levels? What to avoid what looks ok?
Click to expand...

I find that when I go very low carb, cholesterol goes up, even if I don't eat much saturated fat.
I did read about a certain type of response to low carb that involves the body creating more cholesterol, possibly to use for energy. This happens in people who are metabolically healthy.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Case Report: Hypercholesterolemia “Lean Mass Hyper-Responder” Phenotype Presents in the Context of a Low Saturated Fat Carbohydrate-Restricted Diet

Emerging evidence suggests that “leanness” and good metabolic health markers may predict larger increases in LDL cholesterol (LDL-C) in response to carbohydrate restriction. Specifically, a recent cohort study demonstrated an inverse association ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Even though the subjects in this paper had high LDL cholesterol, they had no evidence of plaque.
 
I eat a lot of saturated fat as I follow a low carb higher fat diet, so I have real double cream in my coffee every morning and cheese, cheese and more cheese.... lots of lovely different types though... and fatty meat like lamb chops (on the odd occasion I can afford them) and belly pork and fatty mince, none of this lean minced steak lark and nuts etc and my cholesterol has come down since I started eating more fat.
I think my last test was 4.5 and apart from it being above 4 because they have arbitrarily decided that 4 is the cut off for diabetics, it would be absolutely fine. My diabetes is well managed and I am fitter and healthier than all of my friends my age and some of the younger ones. They would like me to take statins but I have turned them down for now and have no problem with my cholesterol being a bit above 4. If it was 7 or 8 that might be a different matter and I would possibly reconsider but 0.5 is not going to make a significant difference in my opinion and I would rather not put medication into my body that I probably don't need, particularly long term like statins which are basically for life.

From what I understand the myth that cholesterol comes from what you eat has been disproven and certainly my body doesn't adhere to it. I am happy to continue experimenting on my body but I have seen very significant health improvements in many different conditions from changing my diet to eating more fat and less carbs so there would have to be some overwhelming evidence to change my opinion on this. My n=1 experiment shows that saturated fats do not cause high cholesterol in my body. My advice would be to experiment and see how your body responds.

I will however say that I am convinced fibre and particularly soluble fibre plays an important role both with cholesterol regulation and gut/bowel health and I find that a fibre supplement (chia seeds and psyllium husk) is an important part of my daily habit.
 
PGW said:
However she also said that my cholesterol level had gone up since then from 4.8 to 5.2 and prescribed Atorvastatin (40mg per day) to bring it down to below 4 which I believe is the NICE reccomendation for type 2.
Click to expand...

I‘m not sure those general total cholesterol targets are given so much weight any more.

This links to the current NHS cholesterol (lipid - blood fats) management guidelines, which seems to focus more on reducing LDL levels (statins are quite effective at that)


I started a low dose statin when my 5 year risk increased to over 10%. I had always been a little cautious in the past - partly because of the horror stories that are frequently posted, but also because I couldn‘t really understand my own individual level of risk (having lived with sort of above-averagely well-managed diabetes).

I’ve been taking them for more than a year with absolutely no ill effects at all, and my levels have fallen into line very neatly. I still don‘t really know how significant my personal risk reduction will be, but from what I can gather any positive effect will be cumulative over time.

The majority of the evidence suggests you stick with them and see how things go.
 
Dietary cholesterol doesn’t raise cholesterol, the liver compensates, but dietary fats raise both LDL and HDL and research has shown some saturated fats intake blocks LDL receptors in the liver which can lead to a rise.
 
My understanding is that there is very little relationship between the saturated fats you eat and the cholesterol deposited in the arteries. The latter is determined by the liver and can just as easily be influenced by the carbs you eat.
 
DaveB said:
My understanding is that there is very little relationship between the saturated fats you eat and the cholesterol deposited in the arteries.
Click to expand...

I don’t believe that is what the majority of the clinical evidence shows? I think the association between saturated fat intake and increased LDL cholesterol is fairly well understood.

The mechanism is described here:
https://www.heartuk.org.uk/low-cholesterol-foods/saturated-fat#:~:text=Our liver cells have LDL,builds up in the blood.
 
Last edited:
replying to"@everydayupsanddowns".Yes, scares me a bit as in the high protein low carb diet they suggest you eat more meat and most of this is included too."
  • processed meat, such as sausages, burgers, bacon and kebabs
  • butter, lard, ghee, dripping, margarine, goose fat and suet
  • coconut and palm oils and coconut creamfull fat dairy products such as cream, milk, yogurt, crème fraiche and cheese
" The above is quoted from that link. I have underlined what has changed completely in my new diet, I do use 97% Heck sausages which we rarely would eat before but less carbs and not as difficult to eat as meat. Normally hubby would have bacon and I'd have egg on toast but without toast, eggs are really boring. So I now have bacon with eggs. Butter is allowed so I do use that and coconut oil and coconut cream have been in the recipes. However, the most increased difference would be the full-fat dairy products. Cream, full-fat greek yoghurt, and cheese. I almost think the last three plus eggs are coming out of my ears. I do limit to three meals a day but a high proportion of the diet is from fat.
So we shall really see if the medication and the diet are lowering sugar but giving me a cholesterol heart attack instead.
 
Must admit like me cheese butter meats & such but since cholesterol testing began own cholesterol has always been good, total averaging around 4 & below with all ratios inline.

Know for certain that some foods do help lower ldl levels that can lead to build up of atherosclerosis, example those that contain soluble fibre that @rebrascora touched on earlier in thread, as it happens start my day with bowl of porridge & do enjoy eating pulses of different variety, they also say that exercise helps lower cholesterol which is good as like my daily walks which in total is 2 hours or more.

As for statins, there's many scare stories out there pushed by people with agendas, truth is they are widely accepted by experts to be safe & very affective at lowering bad cholesterol levels so reducing cardiovascular risks.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top