Breafast/waking BG

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odd-sock

odd-sock

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Relationship to Diabetes
Type 1
Hi everyone,

I was diagnosed type 1 about 8 weeks ago now and I was just wondering what, typically, everyone elses waking/breakfast BG is.

I think I may be going low in this night and not waking up to treat as regardless of BG before bed when I test before breakfast I'm nealy always higher than target range, 4-7 for me, infact looking at my monitoring diary I've only tested in range before breakfast 4 times since diagnosis. I'm currently on 20 units of Lantus which I take about 11pm and novarapid with meals - typically 12 units with breakfast and 14 units with lunch and dinner. I've also been finding I'm low 2-3 hours after breakfast and lunch so between them to try and keep level.

I'm loath to test at 3am but think I'm going to have to to get a good picture of whats happening in the night.

Sorry it's so long and bit of tanjent
 
At the moment I take 18 units of Humulin I before I go to bed - at this time my BG is usually around 8-10. I am usually somewhere between 6 and 8 when I wake up. I take enough Humulin S to cover what I decide on for breakfast and 2 hours later my BG is usually 6-8. I do find I need a snack between breakfast and lunch to prevent going low in between. I do sometimes wonder if I should try to get my waking BG a bit lower but my HbA1c is pretty constant at 6.2-6.4 so I have just left it
 
Hi I currently take 14 units of lantus and wake between 6 and 6.5. If I am intending on a lay in the next day I take 15 units of lantus which leaves me anywhere between 4 to 5.8. Alcohol the night before also affects my reading which will tend to be nearer 4 than 5. To my knowledge I have never had a night time hypo and was diagnosed 8 weeks ago. If I intend exercising or have exercised I cut back my lantus to between 12 and 14. I was taking more than this but found I was going low 2-3 hours after. I blamed the lantus but my DSN told me to lower the amount of novorapid I took with my evening meal as it was probably still lingering when I took the lantus. I have done this for the last two nights now and it has worked. I test my sugar befor bed and do not go to bed if it is less than 7. I will have a tangerine or biscuit and I have only ever woke up once lower than 4. It sounds like you are taking too much novorapid with your meals try reducing it and see if that stops your lows. Test before meals and for anything above 8 you can compensate with the next dose of insulin (typically 1 unit for 3 mmol above 8). Do you count carbs, I do although I havent had a course, I started with one unit of novorapid per 15g of carbs this can be adjusted down in needed.
 
odd-sock said:
Hi everyone,

I was diagnosed type 1 about 8 weeks ago now and I was just wondering what, typically, everyone elses waking/breakfast BG is.

I think I may be going low in this night and not waking up to treat as regardless of BG before bed when I test before breakfast I'm nealy always higher than target range, 4-7 for me, infact looking at my monitoring diary I've only tested in range before breakfast 4 times since diagnosis. I'm currently on 20 units of Lantus which I take about 11pm and novarapid with meals - typically 12 units with breakfast and 14 units with lunch and dinner. I've also been finding I'm low 2-3 hours after breakfast and lunch so between them to try and keep level.

I'm loath to test at 3am but think I'm going to have to to get a good picture of whats happening in the night.

Sorry it's so long and bit of tanjent
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Hiya, your numbers will be all over the place to start with due to what is known as the honeymoon period. The reason you are going low 2 hrs after meals is because you are on way to much insulin. The simple solution is to cut your insulin back at meal times. The normal thing to do is cut it by 1 or 2 units and see what effect it has.
I must admit to being shocked at the amount you are on your single meal dose is more than I use in a whole day.
Please learn to carb count and adjust your insulin to carb intake. This way you can live a normal life. Ask to see a dietition so you can be shown how to carb count.
There are very few people who get good results using Lantoss once a day. Most split the dose and find it a lot better.
The only way you will know if you are going low in the night is to test at about 2 AM. If you make any changes with Lantoss wait 3 days before you make any more changes. This is due to the time it takes for Lantoss to get into your system.
 
Breakfast Blood Sugars

I am type 2 and diagnosed 3 years ago last December, my blood sugars have never been below 7 at breakfast time, they are always between 7 and 8 every morning no matter what the reading is at supper time.
I take 70 units of Levimer at 8am and 70 units at 6pm...my novorapid is normally 50 units at 8am.....20 units at midday....40 units at 6pm
My HbA1c has always been between 5.7 and 6.1
To increase or decrease my insulin by 1 or 2 units would have no effect on me at all...I have to increase or decrease in multples of 10...lol
For a 70 year old, I think I cope and control things pretty well..my only weakness is chocolate.
 
odd-sock said:
Hi everyone,

I was diagnosed type 1 about 8 weeks ago now and I was just wondering what, typically, everyone elses waking/breakfast BG is.

I think I may be going low in this night and not waking up to treat as regardless of BG before bed when I test before breakfast I'm nealy always higher than target range, 4-7 for me, infact looking at my monitoring diary I've only tested in range before breakfast 4 times since diagnosis. I'm currently on 20 units of Lantus which I take about 11pm and novarapid with meals - typically 12 units with breakfast and 14 units with lunch and dinner. I've also been finding I'm low 2-3 hours after breakfast and lunch so between them to try and keep level.

I'm loath to test at 3am but think I'm going to have to to get a good picture of whats happening in the night.

Sorry it's so long and bit of tanjent
Click to expand...
Hi odd-sock.
I'm on 12,16,16 novorapid and 24 Lantus and wake with anything between 4.2 and 9.9, depends what and how much I had for supper.
 
I'm on 22 units of lantus in the evening and am pretty confident that it's right for me as tend to stay very steady overnight, went to bed at 6.2 last night and woke at 5.4 this morning which is fairly typical.
The only way to really get a good idea if how your basal is working is to do a couple if those 3am tests, they seem a pain at the time but well worth it as once you know your basal is right it's so much easier to work out everything else, particularly if you start carb counting.
 
odd-sock said:
Hi everyone,

I was diagnosed type 1 about 8 weeks ago now and I was just wondering what, typically, everyone elses waking/breakfast BG is.

I think I may be going low in this night and not waking up to treat as regardless of BG before bed when I test before breakfast I'm nealy always higher than target range, 4-7 for me, infact looking at my monitoring diary I've only tested in range before breakfast 4 times since diagnosis. I'm currently on 20 units of Lantus which I take about 11pm and novarapid with meals - typically 12 units with breakfast and 14 units with lunch and dinner. I've also been finding I'm low 2-3 hours after breakfast and lunch so between them to try and keep level.

I'm loath to test at 3am but think I'm going to have to to get a good picture of whats happening in the night.

Sorry it's so long and bit of tanjent
Click to expand...

Hi,

We're pretty identical on insulin doses - not that that means anything with diabetes! But I've had similar suspicions to you about nighttime hypos, so I've been doing the testing at 3 am. I've found that, sometimes I am low so I eat something, sometimes I'm not! No real consistency, but it does take a lot of readings to find a pattern because my bedtime readings aren't consistent. What I mean is, if I am say, 8.5 at bedtime, I won't have a snack, but I might then go low. If I'm say, 6.2 at bedtime I'll have a snack and then not go low. I've tried reducing my lantus by one unit and that does keep me higher, but the problem is that it makes all my fasting levels higher!

Apparently, there are two possibilities for being high in the morning - a steady increase in levels through the night, caused by the liver dump of glucose, or a low in the middle of the night that causes the body to secrete hormones that raise the BG (known as the Somogyi Phenomenon). In the former case, you'd need to increase your basal dose to get better waking levels, but in the latter increasing your dose would make things worse!

You need to find out which is applying to you, so unfortunately I think you're going to have to try and do the 3 am tests:( Or, alternatively, get a continuous BG monitor, which is something I am contemplating.

Good luck!🙂
 
Thanks for you your replies it think i may have it sussed (kinda) now!! Swapped my lantus to the morning at the weekend (not intentionally I must add, had afew 2 many on friday night and forget to take it when I got in!!!) and since then having been waking at around about the same BG.

Type1_sue I've been talking to my DSN about reducing amounts of insulin because I feel like I'm contantly eating coz if I don't I go hypo between every meal but at the moment because reading are still all over the place she's reluctant to let me. I have 'experimented' abit myself and learning to carb count as I've heard that can make things easier.
 
Hi Odd Sock,

For me my waking/breakfast bloods are starting to come in at under 10 mmol/l for at least 1/3 days of the month. It's taken thirten years to work it out.
But here's what I take in a days jabs:
Breakfast - 14 units novorapid and 17 units levemir
Lunch - 16 units novorapid
Tea - 16 units novorapid
Before bed - 30 units levemir

Now here's the catch, every night or nearly every night I test my blood before I go to bed. If it's below 10 mmol/l I take a corrective dose. I work on the principle of one unit novorapid brings my blood down by 2.5 mmol/l. This seems to have helped a fair bit. Last month 14 of my morning blood sugars were below 10 mmol/l compaired to about 5 the previous month.

Tom H
 
I always take 12 units of Levemir at about 11pm whatever my BS levels then. Means that I have some good data on how much 12 units affects me.
 
aymes said:
I'm on 22 units of lantus in the evening and am pretty confident that it's right for me as tend to stay very steady overnight, went to bed at 6.2 last night and woke at 5.4 this morning which is fairly typical.
The only way to really get a good idea if how your basal is working is to do a couple if those 3am tests, they seem a pain at the time but well worth it as once you know your basal is right it's so much easier to work out everything else, particularly if you start carb counting.
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Hi, can I ask, if you test at around 3am are you expecting bs to be pretty much same as you went to bed on or a little lower?
 
tracey w said:
Hi, can I ask, if you test at around 3am are you expecting bs to be pretty much same as you went to bed on or a little lower?
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around the same for me, I wouldn't expect to rise or fall more than 1/1.5 throughout the night so it'd be along those lines usually. I don't seem to experience any sort of dawn phenomenon so that's not a factor for me but may need to be considered for some people. The 3am tests are useful to get a full picture of what's going on, you can get some idea if you're staying level or having night hypos and rebounding etc.
If I test my basal during the day with carb free meals I have the same sort of results.
 
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