Bit disappointed with Fiasp

[rebrascora]

Hi
I was having problems with Novorapid taking more than an hour to start working so I asked to try Fiasp. I read a few stories of people being caught out by it acting so much faster so I have been cautious (anxious even) about prebolussing more than 10-15 mins before food. I have been on it for nearly a month now and had the time and inclination to test it this afternoon, especially as my BG was already high so if it started dropping quickly I had plenty of wriggle room, so to speak to prevent a hypo.
Anyway, here are my results....

1310hrs.... BG 11.2 Took 2.5 units of Fiasp (1 unit for carbs plus 1.5 correction)
1345hrs.... BG 11.5 Drank a glass of water to try to "help things along"
1416hrs.... BG 11.4
1433hrs.... BG 9.5 .... Ate my 1 unit of carbs(10g) at this point (Nature Valley Protein Bar)
1515hrs.... BG 9.2
1530hrs.... BG 10.9 ? What's that about... checked my pen and confirmed I gavemyself 2.5units

Is there any way to increase the speed at which it takes effect as I am pretty good at breaking carbs down quickly so I would normally spike pretty high in that interim period and prebolussing an hour before food is risky because I get distracted and forget to eat. I have tried exercise after injecting the NR but it didn't seem to have any great effect either (I haven't tried that with Fiasp as I was worried it might take me down) and obviously not a great idea on a regular basis as it is a bit risky. Has anyone got any tips?.
Also if the Fiasp gives no improvement on the NR then it makes sense to use the cheapest option.... would I be correct in assuming the NR will be cheaper than the Fiasp? I appreciate the NHS is paying but it is important to me that the minimum expenditure is incurred on my account.

 

[Kaylz]

I've never used Fiasp but I think @everydayupsanddowns has used it at on point in his pump and @Pumper_Sue I think might use it too

I have however seen a lot of people say it does take longer to bring you down and also quite a few have reported that they seem to become immune to Fiasp after using it for a while

I hope you manage to find a way that works for you
xx

 

[Sprogladite]

I found with Novorapid, particularly at breakfast and lunchtime, while I was on MDI that if I waited for it to show an effect before I started eating it could take up to an hour and a half. However, if I waited 15 minutes and then ate, ignoring what my level may be at, the NR kicked in once the food hit my system. Now pumping NR but still sticking to essentially the same thing for pre-bolusing. Hope you find something that works! x

 

[Pumper_Sue]

Have a good look at your basal for starters.
As I explained to you in a previous post Basal has to be correct before you even start and as you only had less than 10 carbs and the bar stated high protein! did you bolus for the protein? IMHO Fiasp due to the way it works is not suitable for high fat/protein diets.

Fiasp and novo are the same price.
I've used Fiasp for over two years and have had no problems with it.

What did you eat for breakfast and at what time?

 

[rebrascora]

Thanks for your replies.
My reading has just come down to 7.5 in the last half hour and may well drop further yet I think.

My basal has been pretty steady for several months and the consultant is happy with it. I went to bed on 5.7 and got up at 0700hrs with a 5.6 and I had a chunk of cheese and a coffee at that time. Then had a 2 egg omelette and salad at 0900hrs and took 2 units of Fiasp with it. BG went up to 10-11 and stayed there until I started my lunchtime experiment at 1310hrs. I have been having low sugar granola with rasps and yoghurt recently for brekky but I was out of yoghurt this morning and hadn't had an omelette for ages so thought I would treat myself.

Interesting that you say that the Fiasp might kick in more quickly if I eat sooner..... no one explained that. I am relying on finger pricking to test so most of the time I have no idea where my readings are but they seldom seem to respond as I would expect or DAFNE would predict.

As I understood it, if there were some carbs in what I ate then I didn't need to bolus the protein only if there were no appreciable carbs like the situation with my omelette although I suppose I did have 3 cherry tomatoes with the salad which would contribute some carbs.

 

[Pumper_Sue]

You need to bolus for protein if no carbs eaten. Many type 1's treat eggs as 4 carbs per egg. Obviously everyone is different.
So have you actually done any day time basal testing?

Eating so called protein bars and cereal bars which tend to have adverse effects on blood sugars are not an ideal substitute for a meal either.

As I have said in another post Fiasp is not designed for high fat/protein meals unless you use a pump thus you can use different delivery modes.

As you have type 1 diabetes thus have insulin to use to cover your meals I can not understand why you insist on eating the way you do. Perhaps go back to normal eating with an eye on carb content obviously.

If you want to carry on the way you are then look into using the older types of insulin as the action would be more suitable for you.

 

[Kaylz]

Just want to say here Barbara, please do what you feel is best for you, feel like you need a bit more support than what your getting here xx

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

I tried Fiasp for 3 vials a few years ago @rebrascora - but I didn’t renew my prescription for it.

Initially it was working quite speedily for me, but then it seemed to revert to more like NR timings, and I found I was needing more and more of it to achieve the expected outcomes. it was also often quite stinging during boluses.

I decided that it wasn’t worth continuing, and was pleased to return to more reliable (for me!) if familiarly sluggish NR.

I wrote about it here if you are interested: https://www.everydayupsanddowns.co.uk/2017/08/fiasp-review-fun-with-5050-and-mystery.html

I’m pleased it works well for Sue, and for others - But I couldn’t get it to work well.

 

[Toucan]

Hello Barbara
As a simple Type 2, I can't help with any of this, but it is good to see that there is plenty of help for you on the forum.
It all sound a lot to have to deal with though, and I hope you soon find the solution that seems to be the best one for you.

 

[everydayupsanddowns]

As I understood it, if there were some carbs in what I ate then I didn't need to bolus the protein only if there were no appreciable carbs like the situation with my omelette although I suppose I did have 3 cherry tomatoes with the salad which would contribute some carbs

I have found over the years that protein conversion into glucose isn’t necessarily dependent on the presence or absence of carbs, but rather that where there are significant carbs, the smaller effect of protein becomes less significant in the general estimation (errors!) I tend to make.

I have found this graph quite helpful
https://www.diabetes-support.org.uk/info/?page_id=438

It seems to chime in with my experience, in that only a proportion of protein or fat convert and over a much longer time. So where carbs are limited they have more effect proportionally. And generally I only see real direct effect (rather than general variation) if a meal has significantly more fat/protein than usual.

this may be because I tend to use a degree of estimation rounding up/down rather than precise measurement of every element to work out my doses!