Checking for Ketones?

[Northerner]

So you don't necessarily fast in order to see what the level is, but just take note of the tests that occur naturally after this period, as fasting tests? Sorry if this seems obvious, as i say, still learning after 2 years!

That's correct - I'm probably using the wrong terminology, perhaps basal test would be more appropriate.

 

[bev]

A Senior doctor at the DUK weekend who is also a diabetic said he tests 3 times a week at least - because ketones can be present even if your well and your levels are ok. Bev

 

[katie]

i thought u produced ketones when you are losing weight and breaking down fat on purpose?

 

[Northerner]

A Senior doctor at the DUK weekend who is also a diabetic said he tests 3 times a week at least - because ketones can be present even if your well and your levels are ok. Bev

As I understand it, ketones are OK, as long as they are being processed by the body, and insulin plays a role in this as well as it's role in glucose - if there's not eough insulin, the ketones build up to unsafe levels.

A non-diabetic person can go on, for example, the Atkins diet which basically burns fat and produces ketones left right and centre - but they can process them and keep them within tolerable limits because they naturally produce enough insulin to cope with it. It can still be dangerous to follow that kind of diet for too long though.

 

[bev]

i thought u produced ketones when you are losing weight and breaking down fat on purpose?

Yes your right Katie, but if you dont have enough insulin on board thats when it becomes dangerous for a diabetic ( i think). 🙂Bev

 

[tracey w]

A Senior doctor at the DUK weekend who is also a diabetic said he tests 3 times a week at least - because ketones can be present even if your well and your levels are ok. Bev

personally i think this is totally unecessary and is not in any of the advice i have heard or been given.

 

[bev]

Hi Tracey,
I think this is one of those things that is a personal choice really , i dont actually know whether its something that should routinely by done. I suppose it doesnt do any harm does it? Alex hasnt been well today and we have checked for ketones all day - happily he hasnt got any - i suppose its about getting into the habit of doing it. 🙂 Bev

 

[runner]

i thought u produced ketones when you are losing weight and breaking down fat on purpose?

Not sure that's how it works - I lost a lot of weight when first diagnosed (on purpose) but didn't have ketones when it was tested during surgery visits, only at beginning when BS levels were high.

All this has made me think tho' because I've never tested myself for ketones in the 2 years since diagnosis. However, When I've been a bit under the weather recently and have been energetic, I have felt very tired and lacking in energy the next day or two to the point I was thinking of going to GP's to find out why - I guess may have been ketones - having a cold was not quite enough to explain it. So, I have decided to ask for some strips and will test occasionally if not feeling right. Thanks for all your info and thoughts about this.

 

[sofaraway]

Wise decision runner, anyone at risk of DKA needs to have access to ketone testing.

I have the optimum xceed and test if my levels are above 20 but it's very rare i show any amount of ketones

 

[runner]

Wise decision runner, anyone at risk of DKA needs to have access to ketone testing.

I have the optimum xceed and test if my levels are above 20 but it's very rare i show any amount of ketones

I'm reloctant to change meters, but no reason why I can't use a different one occassionally I guess! Have you got a web adress or phone number on any of the literature for it? I can't seem to find a direct web adress, just something under construction, which I'm not sure is even the right one.

 

[VanessaK]

Hi Runner,

I am kind of like you I havent really checkded my ketones since diagnosis as I was also under the impression that they only need checking if ill or really high as like you I only had them just before the diagnosis...😱

 

[runner]

Hi Runner,

I am kind of like you I havent really checkded my ketones since diagnosis as I was also under the impression that they only need checking if ill or really high as like you I only had them just before the diagnosis...😱

Yes, I did ask how I could test my ketonbes when my meter is suggesting I need to, but the nurse didn't seem to think I needed to. However, I'm going to get a meter that will test it ans ask for the strips. At the very least, I'll get some urine-testing ones.

 

[Steff]

Hi Runner,

I am kind of like you I havent really checkded my ketones since diagnosis as I was also under the impression that they only need checking if ill or really high as like you I only had them just before the diagnosis...😱

totally the same not checked ,oh i have done once and was clear

 

[tracey w]

Hi Tracey,
I think this is one of those things that is a personal choice really , i dont actually know whether its something that should routinely by done. I suppose it doesnt do any harm does it? Alex hasnt been well today and we have checked for ketones all day - happily he hasnt got any - i suppose its about getting into the habit of doing it. 🙂 Bev

I completely agree, personal choice and certainly wont do any harm to check, for me though I would not check routinely 3 times a week, we do enough checking and stabbing etc as it is! If you are ill, I agree this is a different matter entirely.

 

[tracey w]

I'm reloctant to change meters, but no reason why I can't use a different one occassionally I guess! Have you got a web adress or phone number on any of the literature for it? I can't seem to find a direct web adress, just something under construction, which I'm not sure is even the right one.

If you are happy with your current meter thats fine, just use the exceed for blood ketone testing when you need to. Most dsn should have them, i think they give them out routinely to type ones, you just need to get a prescription for the strips.

 

[Caroline Wilson]

I saw the DSN this morning and asked about testing ketones. I was told as a type 2 I wouldn't produce ketones as I still had some pancreas function.

 

[runner]

Thanks Tracey - good luck tomorrow!

 

[Copepod]

I found this page of advice on testing for ketones (for type 1 diabetes), by Dumfries & Galloway NHS www.dgdiabetes.scot.nhs.uk/icp/icptype1/ketones.shtml which seems pretty good. One thing to bear in mind is that blood ketone testing strips are even more expensive than blood glucose testing strips ?23.79 for 10 Optium blood glucose test strips compared with ?18.50 for 50 blood glucose test strips - see http://www.pcpdirect.co.uk/Pharmacy/Diabetes_Testing. OK, these are prices to the public, and NHS has probably got better deals, but the relative prices will be comparable. Urine ketone testing strips are relatively cheap eg http://www.valuemed.co.uk/acatalog/Ketone_Tests.html 100 for ?5.99. So, it's clear that a GP would prefer to prescribe testing strips costing 6p per (urine ketone) test compared with ?2.38 per (blood ketone) test (40 times more!), even though the tests are different - ketones show in blood before urine.

Personally, I prefer not to cost the NHS any more than essential - in particular, I only test if I can make use of the information. In fact, the only reason I have some blood ketone tests strips is because a GP prescribed them by accident - I never used them. If I get a high blood glucose reading eg over 15mmol/l, then I correct with short acting insulin, and check again in a couple of hours, rather than testing for ketones.

 

[runner]

I found this page of advice on testing for ketones (for type 1 diabetes), by Dumfries & Galloway NHS www.dgdiabetes.scot.nhs.uk/icp/icptype1/ketones.shtml which seems pretty good. So, it's clear that a GP would prefer to prescribe testing strips costing 6p per (urine ketone) test compared with ?2.38 per (blood ketone) test (40 times more!), even though the tests are different - ketones show in blood before urine.

Personally, I prefer not to cost the NHS any more than essential - in particular, I only test if I can make use of the information. If I get a high blood glucose reading eg over 15mmol/l, then I correct with short acting insulin, and check again in a couple of hours, rather than testing for ketones.

Thanks for the link - it's confirmed, with what some of the others on this forum have said, that I need to have the facility to check for ketones.
Even when you can reduce the BS with a dose, it looks like a person needs to check their ketones as per the advice in the link...

I understand and sympathise with wanting to save the NHS money, however, for me, that is an issue between the government and the hugely profit-making pharmaceutical companies. Any government who would nationalise them gets my vote! I don't like to waste anything, but I will use the most efficient means for maintaining my health, so I'll try for the meter/blood-testing route. I am after all saving the NHS on the Statins I refuse to use just as a routine precautionary measure, just as I will ignore the advice to put all over 50's on blood-pressure lowering medication if I don't have high blood pressure (which I don't) 😉 thanks for your help and advice tho'