Diet confusion - low carb or low fat?

[Snowy9]

So, its fair to say that there isnt a consensus.....

Teenage daughter is just passing around truffles....

 

[bulkbiker]

So, its fair to say that there isnt a consensus.....

Teenage daughter is just passing around truffles....

There are people who use low carb and people who use low cal.
Advocates for either will have likely had success with their chosen method.
Personally I tried low cal for years and slowly gained weight until I became morbidly obese and was diagnosed with T2.
I then learned about low carb put it into practise and lost a shedload of weight and put T2 in remission pretty quickly.
I also regained my health and put a load of other health conditions into reverse hence I will advocate it forever as I believe it saved my life, eyes and toes.
I'm of the school of thought that crash diets are rarely effective for long term sustained weight loss and there are plenty of studies that will back that up.

 

[Brambleberry]

@Snowy9
Diabetes is an inability to deal with dietary carbohydrate, so I can't see how eating a low fat diet is going to be much help in controlling it.
I live on protein and the natural fats, with carbs for texture colour and flavour - limited to under 40 gm a day and seem to have type 2 beaten. I have lost weight, but I think that was mostly due to giving up on the high carb low fat diet sheet printout from my GP.
Eating low carb seems simple, easy and effective, requires little support and no outlay on paid for advice. Eating lots of fruit and veges seems a sure and certain recipe for high blood glucose levels.

Can i ask when you say 40g carbs a day are these your veggies/fruit etc? I am seriously considering a fasting or keto diet as I am now off the glicozide but despite on 130g carbs and 1200, 1300 calories a day I have plateaued for the last 6 weeks.( lost 26 lbs -so pretty frustrated).

 

[Drummer]

Can i ask when you say 40g carbs a day are these your veggies/fruit etc? I am seriously considering a fasting or keto diet as I am now off the glicozide but despite on 130g carbs and 1200, 1300 calories a day I have plateaued for the last 6 weeks.( lost 26 lbs -so pretty frustrated).

Yes.
I always had problems with carbs, but was always pressured to 'eat a healthy diet' which was far too high in carbs, so when I reached the age of 65 I was really overweight and feeling rather old.
When diagnosed I returned to no more than 50 gm of carbs a day as that was what I had eaten on Atkins.
I found that I need to eat a small amount of carbs first thing to stop my blood glucose rising - I only eat twice a day these days. I have about 10 of carbs in the morning, something on the lines of a chop or steak with a stirfry, or I do a bit of onion with the meat and some mushrooms in the wok - mushrooms seem to be a lot damper than I remember them - probably the supermarkets have found a way to make them heavier. I do sometimes have 'bubble and squeal' - which is made with swede rather than potato. I sometimes eat it with bacon, or spread it with grated cheese and put it under the grill.
I also have found that low calorie diets simply stop working for me, so I just concentrate on the carbs.
In the evening I have mostly veges for the rest of my carbs for the day. I do make low carb desserts with sugar free jelly, or gelatine and yoghurt, usually with berries and cream. I don't make them every week.
I used to eat tuna fairly often, but now I get cheap pink salmon and there is enough in the tin for dinner and to eat as an omelette next morning

 

[Brambleberry]

Yes.
I always had problems with carbs, but was always pressured to 'eat a healthy diet' which was far too high in carbs, so when I reached the age of 65 I was really overweight and feeling rather old.
When diagnosed I returned to no more than 50 gm of carbs a day as that was what I had eaten on Atkins.
I found that I need to eat a small amount of carbs first thing to stop my blood glucose rising - I only eat twice a day these days. I have about 10 of carbs in the morning, something on the lines of a chop or steak with a stirfry, or I do a bit of onion with the meat and some mushrooms in the wok - mushrooms seem to be a lot damper than I remember them - probably the supermarkets have found a way to make them heavier. I do sometimes have 'bubble and squeal' - which is made with swede rather than potato. I sometimes eat it with bacon, or spread it with grated cheese and put it under the grill.
I also have found that low calorie diets simply stop working for me, so I just concentrate on the carbs.
In the evening I have mostly veges for the rest of my carbs for the day. I do make low carb desserts with sugar free jelly, or gelatine and yoghurt, usually with berries and cream. I don't make them every week.
I used to eat tuna fairly often, but now I get cheap pink salmon and there is enough in the tin for dinner and to eat as an omelette next morning

Sounds like me! I never overate, nor did I have a bad diet. I gained weight easily and found it hard to shift. Pain meds side effects then made it even harder.I think I am going to have to have a go.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Sounds like me! I never overate, nor did I have a bad diet. I gained weight easily and found it hard to shift. Pain meds side effects then made it even harder.I think I am going to have to have a go.

It's an interesting point, low carb very often ends up as low calorie by default.
@Drummer will agree, it's a hunger suppressor.
Take the tin of salmon. It's providing the main protein source for the only two meals a day she eats, nothing in between.
That's less than 300 calories.
That used to be a snack for me!

 

[bulkbiker]

low carb very often ends up as low calorie by default.

Does it?
Fat has twice the calories of carbs or protein..

 

[Brambleberry]

Does it?
Fat has twice the calories of carbs or protein..

Its interesting because getting energy from protein costs the liver energy so not a straight forward situation, fat is more easily used. The saying a calorie is not a calorie seems to apply to keto diets particularly in that sense. But I remember doing a candida diet with the herbalist years ago and she said I would drop stone in a month it was lower in carbs but low sugar and had nuts and seeds and oils in it....I was suspicious it would not work....too high in fat for me and I was correct I only lost a couple of pounds so the next month I cut the seeds nuts and oil out then I dropped a little more weight and she commented I must be sensitive to fats...if you ask me my body is sensitive to anything at all....I swear if I ate fresh air I would still have a problem!

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Does it?
Fat has twice the calories of carbs or protein..

Yes, it does.
You like steaks?
How many kilo do you eat a day?

 

[Brambleberry]

I suppose there are so many proteins with varying amounts of fat and calories. Oily fish very healthy full of good fats but higher in calories than fresh tuna, or a white fish. Chicken being lower in calories than lamb etc. I have been making sure my red meat is grass fed animals for a long time. I know where my fish is sourced too. Well its all a journey of discovery !

 

[Deleted member 21371]

I suppose there are so many proteins with varying amounts of fat and calories. Oily fish very healthy full of good fats but higher in calories than fresh tuna, or a white fish. Chicken being lower in calories than lamb etc. I have been making sure my red meat is grass fed animals for a long time. I know where my fish is sourced too. Well its all a journey of discovery !

Grass fed is a moveable feast.
They may never actually see live grass.
It depends on the season, and the farms.

Oily fish is usually farmed, and farmed fish food is mostly made from the last farmed generation, so toxins build up.
Tinned fish? Could be from anywhere.

 

[Brambleberry]

Grass fed is a moveable feast.
They may never actually see live grass.
It depends on the season, and the farms.

Oily fish is usually farmed, and farmed fish food is mostly made from the last farmed generation, so toxins build up.
Tinned fish? Could be from anywhere.

Yes I get wild salmon and my trout comes from a fresh water loch here in Scotland. It is not farmed as such. And is the best of tastes!

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Yes I get wild salmon and my trout comes from a fresh water loch here in Scotland. It is not farmed as such. And is the best of tastes!

Netted in. Feed is pellets. I looked at fish farming there. It's very industrial.
My local trout farm is a fishing site.
The trout's arrive in a dumper!

 

[bulkbiker]

You like steaks?
How many kilo do you eat a day?

Tonight it was about 700g of Argentinian sirloin ..

 

[Leadinglights]

Tonight it was about 700g of Argentinian sirloin ..

That sounds like the challenge at a restaurant in Prague many years ago. Free meal if you could eat a 64oz steak.
Big steaks 32oz used to be on the menu at a pub near Market Bosworth. You might be lucky to get an 8oz one these day the price they are.

 

[Brambleberry]

I tried to eat too locally smoked kippers for breakfast and could only eat 1 and a half! I can eat two from the supermarket and usually soak up the butter with a slice of bread for the bones...but today I only had kippers no butter or bread....but thats 434 calories for breakfast should I be counting calories on keto?

 

[42istheanswer]

I tried to eat too locally smoked kippers for breakfast and could only eat 1 and a half! I can eat two from the supermarket and usually soak up the butter with a slice of bread for the bones...but today I only had kippers no butter or bread....but thats 434 calories for breakfast should I be counting calories on keto?

There is debate about that. If you are aiming to lose or gain weight then counting calories may be useful - if you find that you aren't gaining/losing as much as you want then you can consider adjusting the calories too. If you aren't really bothered if your weight changes then counting calories isn't particularly needed.

 

[Brambleberry]

There is debate about that. If you are aiming to lose or gain weight then counting calories may be useful - if you find that you aren't gaining/losing as much as you want then you can consider adjusting the calories too. If you aren't really bothered if your weight changes then counting calories isn't particularly needed.

Good to know. I lost 26 lb doing low carb but it has plateaued for 6 weeks. So I reduced it to 1200/1300 calories the last 2 weeks to no avail. My body loves to fight back! So I will calorie count and see where 1200 calories goes....I will give it a month and if no good I am going to ask about the Newcastle diet because I think they have to monitor you in that and so if there are issues they will see them for once instead of thinking I am lying about my diet.The meds won't be helping of course for the fibro they cause weight gain all the clinical papers say so but yet the doctors still deny what is in black and white makes me so frustrated.

 

[Deleted member 21371]

Tonight it was about 700g of Argentinian sirloin ..

Exactly.

It's taken you years to build into eating that amount, most wouldn't manage that from day 1.
Mine last night was around 250g for comparison.
But 700 g still only gives you around 2000 calories, so it's reasonable maintenance diet for many.

However, as you have said your weight is rising again, maybe knock it down a bit? Too many calories will put on weight regardless of where they come from it seems.
(And that's a trek if that's from your local butcher!)

 

[bulkbiker]

But 700 g still only gives you around 2000 calories, so it's reasonable maintenance diet for many.

Why do you assume that the steak was all I ate yesterday?

as you have said your weight is rising again,

No that's what you just said..
My weight has been pretty stable over the past few months even with 3 weeks in Thailand not eating any rice or noodles.